Good bye: untergrund.net will be shutting down on December 15th
category: general [glöplog]
But: volunteers welcome. Not saying it is impossible, just not easy.
Scamp, first of all many thanks for providing free hosting for the demoscene for the past 25 years.
I still have my old site on untergrund.net which admittedly I haven't updated for a while (but that's not to say I will never do it) but there are many more important websites hosted there so I hope a solution can be found.
I wouldn't really like the demoscene to be mostly retreating to Discord and a handful of Facebook groups.
I still have my old site on untergrund.net which admittedly I haven't updated for a while (but that's not to say I will never do it) but there are many more important websites hosted there so I hope a solution can be found.
I wouldn't really like the demoscene to be mostly retreating to Discord and a handful of Facebook groups.
With a 25 years old kernel PCem might be an option, it can run Windows XP but it's an emulator and might be too slow apart from other issues since it was definitely not made for web hosting ;)
Let's be honest. A change of operator/server owner makes the most sense.
Is this possible scamp?
Especially when it comes to Chiptune.com and the Amiga Demo Archive,C64 Diskmag Wiki and many more it would be a shame if they disappeared.
I think if this shutdown is food for thought for anyone, the message has gotten through.
Is this possible scamp?
Especially when it comes to Chiptune.com and the Amiga Demo Archive,C64 Diskmag Wiki and many more it would be a shame if they disappeared.
I think if this shutdown is food for thought for anyone, the message has gotten through.
docd: please read THIS (not the other) threads in full.
None of this has to do with emotions, and none with who hosts this in future, it's a technical challenge someone needs to work on.
I know you always have very good intentions and are trying to de-escalate. but there is no de-escalation needed here, people writing scripts and managing the transition are needed.
truck is right now trying to find such people. Those who want to volunteer on the tech work contact truck, all others including myself: stand by.
None of this has to do with emotions, and none with who hosts this in future, it's a technical challenge someone needs to work on.
I know you always have very good intentions and are trying to de-escalate. but there is no de-escalation needed here, people writing scripts and managing the transition are needed.
truck is right now trying to find such people. Those who want to volunteer on the tech work contact truck, all others including myself: stand by.
ok cool
to scamp:
actually, personally I'm more concerned about releases that are hosted on Untergrund.net. For example, many release links on Pouet.net lead to Untergrund.net. Maybe at least access to these files via HTTP can be preserved?
actually, personally I'm more concerned about releases that are hosted on Untergrund.net. For example, many release links on Pouet.net lead to Untergrund.net. Maybe at least access to these files via HTTP can be preserved?
bitl: There are only 127 untergrund.net links from Pouët prods that I have not already been able to archive as part of my nightly pouet-mirror.sesse.net runs; the other 8994 are fine, plus a bunch of links that no longer are referenced. (Some of those are 404, most are 403; I don't know exactly what happened.)
bitl: See previous page of this thread for an explanation. The FTP can not be moved as long as the "main" site is up, as it's mounted over there and shares user permissions.
As soon as the "main site problem is next to impossible to transplant" is solved in one way or another, it can live on read-only, be moved to someone else hosting it (keeping the links intact) or serving redirects to some other server without links breaking.
I have my own stuff on there, and my own links to it ;)
But the more backups, the better, of course.
As soon as the "main site problem is next to impossible to transplant" is solved in one way or another, it can live on read-only, be moved to someone else hosting it (keeping the links intact) or serving redirects to some other server without links breaking.
I have my own stuff on there, and my own links to it ;)
But the more backups, the better, of course.
I really hope you have found peace as you claim Scamp. But to be completely honest- It just doesn't really sound like that, the sense of anger and confusion is what prevails. With all due respect- You say that you've been doing stuff for me for 30 years while we met for the first time only ~15 years ago. You claim that I'm "believing some bullshit people claim I (ed: Scamp) have said about you which I didn't"- but I have absolutely no clue who those people would be, what you could allegedly have said about me, or why I should even give a damn about that. Last but not least, you claim I "constantly try to bash me (ed: Scamp) wherever you could", which just sounds weird to me because our last serious interaction was when I helped to spread the slide for your party. Sure enough, we haven't always agreed on matters, and I'm not the kind of person to hold back my opinions in any scenario. But fact of the matter is, we hardly know eachother on a personal level and as a logical consequence of that, the amount of real estate you own inside my world of thought is rather minimal. I would have hoped the reverse to be also true, but that seems not to be the case, and that is unfortunate to say the least.
So yeah, again, I hope your recent outings on this site are a misrepresentation of your current state of mind, and that you may find a more obviously/outwardly peaceful path soon.
So yeah, again, I hope your recent outings on this site are a misrepresentation of your current state of mind, and that you may find a more obviously/outwardly peaceful path soon.
I am not good at human-to-human conversation, and it's normal that when I write someone "hello, I would like to order a pizza" that they assume I am planning to kill them.
You may or may have not noticed that I am perceived differently face-to-face.
F2F I can say the exact same things as I write, but suddenly that pizza shop no longer applies I want to burn them down, but understands I want a pizza.
My defect, my problem, you don't have to like my position on the autistic spectrum, as a matter of fact, I also don't like my position on the autistic spectrum. In general I would have preferred to have a leg missing instead of being unable to communicate with the outside world since I was a kid. Not everybody gets dealt the hand they want.
Anyway: I helped Outline once, and I never "un-helped". So, no, I don't know what's going on on your side. That's why I mentioned it and randomly guessed potential motivations.
And look: My point is I have never said any bad word about you behind your back, and don't understand your rage.
On the other hand: Check your Discord backlog how much time has passed since you have last spread pretty disgusting stuff about me out of completely thin air there, knowing I am not around, and feeling "safe" to spread that shit.
See, now you know.
My communication style is toxic. For other people, it's the ethics and behavior that is toxic.
And I will pick an autist with bad communication style any day over an autist that is just in the game to fuck up other people so they feel just as miserable as themselves.
You spend a hell lot of time every day trying to drag down people. That is not a nice thing to do.
I on the other hand just come here every couple of months to shit on your carpet so some people maybe wake up and see what is going on.
Yes, when it is about the game of "what it is more important - what you say or what you do?", I am your end boss.
Stop making people miserable as a project. Doing it by mistake is acceptable. Doing it on purpose is not.
HTH, HAND :)
You may or may have not noticed that I am perceived differently face-to-face.
F2F I can say the exact same things as I write, but suddenly that pizza shop no longer applies I want to burn them down, but understands I want a pizza.
My defect, my problem, you don't have to like my position on the autistic spectrum, as a matter of fact, I also don't like my position on the autistic spectrum. In general I would have preferred to have a leg missing instead of being unable to communicate with the outside world since I was a kid. Not everybody gets dealt the hand they want.
Anyway: I helped Outline once, and I never "un-helped". So, no, I don't know what's going on on your side. That's why I mentioned it and randomly guessed potential motivations.
And look: My point is I have never said any bad word about you behind your back, and don't understand your rage.
On the other hand: Check your Discord backlog how much time has passed since you have last spread pretty disgusting stuff about me out of completely thin air there, knowing I am not around, and feeling "safe" to spread that shit.
See, now you know.
My communication style is toxic. For other people, it's the ethics and behavior that is toxic.
And I will pick an autist with bad communication style any day over an autist that is just in the game to fuck up other people so they feel just as miserable as themselves.
You spend a hell lot of time every day trying to drag down people. That is not a nice thing to do.
I on the other hand just come here every couple of months to shit on your carpet so some people maybe wake up and see what is going on.
Yes, when it is about the game of "what it is more important - what you say or what you do?", I am your end boss.
Stop making people miserable as a project. Doing it by mistake is acceptable. Doing it on purpose is not.
HTH, HAND :)
I'm not sure what's going on here. It's like passing by the site of a car crash: impossible to understand what happened, yet hard to look away.
But whatever happens, thanks for hosting the GeeksCanDance site on such short notice and for all the other cool stuff you've done and contributed. I really wish SceneCity had worked out, especially the video capturing and archiving part. Watching my demos in poor quality with ad breaks makes me want to throw up.
It took me a while to get to know you better. Now, if I had to choose between meeting any random person or you, I'd pick you. I really hope you're doing well and that we stay in touch.
But whatever happens, thanks for hosting the GeeksCanDance site on such short notice and for all the other cool stuff you've done and contributed. I really wish SceneCity had worked out, especially the video capturing and archiving part. Watching my demos in poor quality with ad breaks makes me want to throw up.
It took me a while to get to know you better. Now, if I had to choose between meeting any random person or you, I'd pick you. I really hope you're doing well and that we stay in touch.
pixtur:
I am very fine, thank you. Divorces never have been easy for me.
Personal Executive summary is:
I wanted to find out if the scene still cares about scene infrastructure running by sceners vs. just using commercial services, including long-term consquences.
Longer version:
https://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=12733&page=1
Read my first long post, forget the rest.
My personal conclusions were:
1.) Nobody wants SceneCity.TV, the scene prefer Twitch/YouTube
2.) Nobody wants SceneCity.Chat, the scene prefers Discord
3.) untergrund.net only contains of dead sites nobody cares about
As it turned out then, conclusion 3.) was wrong. There it was simply because shit was running without problems for 25 years, I just never heard again from happy users. Which is why untergrund.net is NOT shutting down but will return a static site. Not a (big) ego thing, but I did notice that when there are reports/lectures/podcasts about "what are the oldest and biggest demoscene sites" untergrund.net has never been mentioned during the last decade.
But again, when it comes to untergrund.net, it looks like I have simply asked the wrong people.
The emotional part is:
- The standards I have set in regards of demoparty organizing are no longer achievable or wanted
- During the last couple of years I have felt more and more disinvited, with in the end receiving *active* disinvitations
- Focus over the years when it comes to me have dramatically shifted from "what is he providing to the scene" to "his broken social communication skills are no longer acceptable"
Which have caused me (and fashion, who is not treated as an individual, and therefore is always suffering from people ceasing contact with me) to gradually switch to a more welcome art/nerd subculture, where what you do counts more than the way you communicate, and most importantly where we have a fresh start and I am not judged on behavior from 10+ years ago.
Thank you for pointing out that it takes a while to get to know me better. My big disappointment is that those who DO know me better, including those who do for 20+ years, no longer wanting me in the scene.
But again, I'm fine. It is an ongoing active process for months to find out if a divorce is needed, and I knew it would not be easy, so I am doing those steps whenever I feel stable and relaxed enough for it. My communication style as always makes it look different, but no worries :)
Thank you!
I am very fine, thank you. Divorces never have been easy for me.
Personal Executive summary is:
I wanted to find out if the scene still cares about scene infrastructure running by sceners vs. just using commercial services, including long-term consquences.
Longer version:
https://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=12733&page=1
Read my first long post, forget the rest.
My personal conclusions were:
1.) Nobody wants SceneCity.TV, the scene prefer Twitch/YouTube
2.) Nobody wants SceneCity.Chat, the scene prefers Discord
3.) untergrund.net only contains of dead sites nobody cares about
As it turned out then, conclusion 3.) was wrong. There it was simply because shit was running without problems for 25 years, I just never heard again from happy users. Which is why untergrund.net is NOT shutting down but will return a static site. Not a (big) ego thing, but I did notice that when there are reports/lectures/podcasts about "what are the oldest and biggest demoscene sites" untergrund.net has never been mentioned during the last decade.
But again, when it comes to untergrund.net, it looks like I have simply asked the wrong people.
The emotional part is:
- The standards I have set in regards of demoparty organizing are no longer achievable or wanted
- During the last couple of years I have felt more and more disinvited, with in the end receiving *active* disinvitations
- Focus over the years when it comes to me have dramatically shifted from "what is he providing to the scene" to "his broken social communication skills are no longer acceptable"
Which have caused me (and fashion, who is not treated as an individual, and therefore is always suffering from people ceasing contact with me) to gradually switch to a more welcome art/nerd subculture, where what you do counts more than the way you communicate, and most importantly where we have a fresh start and I am not judged on behavior from 10+ years ago.
Thank you for pointing out that it takes a while to get to know me better. My big disappointment is that those who DO know me better, including those who do for 20+ years, no longer wanting me in the scene.
But again, I'm fine. It is an ongoing active process for months to find out if a divorce is needed, and I knew it would not be easy, so I am doing those steps whenever I feel stable and relaxed enough for it. My communication style as always makes it look different, but no worries :)
Thank you!
Let's please continue here and retire THIS thread as the topic is now outdated:
https://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=9917
https://www.pouet.net/topic.php?which=9917