How jobb?
category: general [glöplog]
I'd like to know of sceners whose work is similar to making scene prods. What do you do, how did you get that job and does it pay compared to enterprise software (yuck!)?
I worked on launching the offline mode of Google Maps Mobile last year, and I've never had so much use before for my 64k experience :-) (Turns out that knowing how to rearranging data to please compressors is not very common… maybe obvious in retrospect. Picking the right compiler flags for shaving off code size, too.)
A lot of people work on games, obviously. Right now the job market for talented game programmers is good (at least in Finland) and the salaries are comparable (or greater) than enterprise software. Personally I work at EA and couldn't be happier.
A big bonus in getting my first job (graphics programming for medical VR) was probably the fact that someone at the company had seen my first 4k, which I had also mentioned in my cv. I'll be switching jobs in two months and start working on a raytracer though and that new job was a direct consequence of other sceners working there who made contact. Take that, parents who always told me I should focus my energy on "useful" things!
While for both jobs the subject is quite similar to what I do in the scene (computer graphics programming), you asked about "similar to making scene prods",which is is something different. For example, a scene prod is "finished" at some point, instead of being iterated upon continuously and it changes course during its development all the time depending on the low hanging fruits that present themselves. That was not true for the work I've been doing.
No idea how much coding enterprise software pays, really. I got enough to work only 4 days a week (while living in a shared flat, not owning a car and not going on fancy vacations).
While for both jobs the subject is quite similar to what I do in the scene (computer graphics programming), you asked about "similar to making scene prods",which is is something different. For example, a scene prod is "finished" at some point, instead of being iterated upon continuously and it changes course during its development all the time depending on the low hanging fruits that present themselves. That was not true for the work I've been doing.
No idea how much coding enterprise software pays, really. I got enough to work only 4 days a week (while living in a shared flat, not owning a car and not going on fancy vacations).
I think the still guys are the closest to "demoscene as a job" type of gig. Is iq still with pixar?
Nah, Oculus.
I make shaders, visual conceptualization and UX/UI things. It's not that far off from making demos really. I got into it by first working on mobile apps, then progressing to graphics/multimedia stuff and then working in the games industry on all kinds of positions, engine dev, porting, gamedev, tool dev, app dev...
Then tried our hand at making our own mobile game and then doing some PS4 consulting, and after doing a stint at some startup work I got back to working with some familiar scene people from Finland, which is what I'm currently doing right now. It pays well enough for a Finnish salary scale.
Then tried our hand at making our own mobile game and then doing some PS4 consulting, and after doing a stint at some startup work I got back to working with some familiar scene people from Finland, which is what I'm currently doing right now. It pays well enough for a Finnish salary scale.
I'd just like to state that PHP and MySQL are probably yuckier than enterprise software (although *sometimes* designing tables can be fun.....).
Working on games is quite a natural choice. Also that's the closest you can get with the excitement and feeling of delivering a demo in a major party just before (or after) the deadline - shipping a game title that is a result of months and months worth of team work and seeing how the audience reacts to it. Well, maybe not the same thing, but at least a somewhat valid excuse for not having time to make a demo. :)
Gaming industry has been catching up with salaries compared to other software development lately. Of course it can all depend very much on whether it's a bigger and more established company or a smaller indie studio - there's ups and downs for both. Freedom vs. guaranteed living and such.
I'm doing mostly server-side programming these days. And unlike with most of the disciplines, you know you've succeeded when your part is invisible to the players. Profiling and load testing a highly scalable backend that supports millions of players can be both fun and challenging.
Gaming industry has been catching up with salaries compared to other software development lately. Of course it can all depend very much on whether it's a bigger and more established company or a smaller indie studio - there's ups and downs for both. Freedom vs. guaranteed living and such.
I'm doing mostly server-side programming these days. And unlike with most of the disciplines, you know you've succeeded when your part is invisible to the players. Profiling and load testing a highly scalable backend that supports millions of players can be both fun and challenging.
PS. I thought this thread was about Haujobb - stumbled upon this almost by accident...
I've done quite a lot of demo tools, and work as a tools developer in the games industry :)
i initially thought the thread would be about haujobb aswell :D
i ended up doing developer and project management work for a small creative computing company (10 people), doing a little bit of everything needed to keep the boat afloat from writing proposals, updating websites, preparing workplans, telling clients their requirements are stupid, sysadmin, project architecture, fire department debugging, custom tech research, handling recruiting, documenting closed projects, etc.
demoscene experience of following tight delivery schedules and realistic time plans helps a lot. also a plus in the creative parts of the job.
i ended up doing developer and project management work for a small creative computing company (10 people), doing a little bit of everything needed to keep the boat afloat from writing proposals, updating websites, preparing workplans, telling clients their requirements are stupid, sysadmin, project architecture, fire department debugging, custom tech research, handling recruiting, documenting closed projects, etc.
demoscene experience of following tight delivery schedules and realistic time plans helps a lot. also a plus in the creative parts of the job.
and it gets handy to run a netlabel when you need music for a random project video :p
Enterprise software is not necessarily disgusting and every software needs intelligence and dedication.
Anyway I run my own business within software engineering and I often have to demo concepts / software to customers :)
Anyway I run my own business within software engineering and I often have to demo concepts / software to customers :)
I'm doing science, working as a postdoc in space plasma physics.
The actual nature of the work I'm doing, large plasma simulations, is surprisingly similar to coding demos, in that we use big computers, re-invent the wheel most of the time, nobody ever looks at our sourcecode and it really only has to work once to produce a result.
Of course, the motivational framework around it is somewhat different from the demoscene, in that we don't "fake it to make it look good". Ugly results are often better than good-looking ones, otherwise they raise suspicion! But in the end, getting a scientific paper into print takes about as much sweat and tears as releasing a demo does, and it feels kinda similar too.
The actual nature of the work I'm doing, large plasma simulations, is surprisingly similar to coding demos, in that we use big computers, re-invent the wheel most of the time, nobody ever looks at our sourcecode and it really only has to work once to produce a result.
Of course, the motivational framework around it is somewhat different from the demoscene, in that we don't "fake it to make it look good". Ugly results are often better than good-looking ones, otherwise they raise suspicion! But in the end, getting a scientific paper into print takes about as much sweat and tears as releasing a demo does, and it feels kinda similar too.
Oh, and science pay is bad, contracts are always time-limited, you are always understaffed and have to keep begging for money. But we don't have customers, products or deadlines really, so I suppose the difference in pay stands in direct relation to the difference in total pain. :)
And once in a while, a space agency calls me and asks for advice. That's worth a lot more than pay. :)
And once in a while, a space agency calls me and asks for advice. That's worth a lot more than pay. :)
So you _literally_ study plasma effects all day. Cool. :D
my spectrum code skillz never helped at any job, as well as experimental music making love. so i hate you all successfull bastards )))
I do 3D engines/frameworks for heavy-ish industry (not games tho) and I love my job.
my (very little) demo coding skills helped me to impress customers with no clue that I am a mastermind for their totally demo-coding-unrelated software development job
Also in science (geophysics.) My finely-honed skills & knowledge as a demoscene musician & occasional artist have helped me not one bit. I eventually learned to code, in a language I hate (Octave/Matlab) which is completely useless for doing anything fun. Yep.
That said my sort-of scene related 'fishing-derelict-electronics-out-of-the-trash-and-repurposing-them-to-do-what-i-want' skills occasionally pay off. There is already one major tsunami warning network in the world that has permanent installations running using crap I found in a dumpster. I'm working on a second.
That said my sort-of scene related 'fishing-derelict-electronics-out-of-the-trash-and-repurposing-them-to-do-what-i-want' skills occasionally pay off. There is already one major tsunami warning network in the world that has permanent installations running using crap I found in a dumpster. I'm working on a second.
Fusetools, a toolkit to build cross-platform mobile apps, is built by many demosceners. At first glance, it might not be very related, but it's all 3d accelerated under the hood, and the tooling is pretty damn cool. As a guy who was always better at making demotools than demos, I really appreciate what they did there.
I've no idea how Duckers got the thing funded, but judging the team size, salaries can't be entirely horrible.
I've no idea how Duckers got the thing funded, but judging the team size, salaries can't be entirely horrible.
I am currently working as lead programmer for a small enterprise, developing applications for engineers. One of our products utilizes VTK for displaying 3D models. VTK is not a tool typically used by demosceners, but it does its job. Occasionally I also proofread business emails for my boss, so the experience I gained with editing Hugi pays off.
I'm also working in science. At the moment I'm working with software visualizations which is kind of related as I need to do graphics stuff, but then again it's more about managing the data for my case. Before that I did some things related to interactive 3D-graphics and WebGL.
I guess the scene led directly to my current work... indirectly :) I always loved demos, 3d gfx, any kind of cool graphic effects, and eventually (after many years believing i couldn't code) learned some basic php, made some websites, then learned a bit of GLSL and started making some simple 2D stuff.
Then the iPhone app store happened, I had an iPhone then and wanted to learn to code more, so as I learned I wrote a few apps and sold them. None sold super well, but hey, a bit of extra beer money while you're learning isn't a bad thing :)
Later though I got better, and mixed in the demo stuff I'd learned - processing live camera data with GLSL. I started making pretty decent money then, quit my day job, and I'm still doing that.
Dunno how it pays compared to enterprise stuff. I'd guess similar over say 1 year, but a lot more unpredictable, like one month I can earn just enough to cover the bills, then I can earn the same amount in 1 day. (That, sadly, never lasts ;)
Then the iPhone app store happened, I had an iPhone then and wanted to learn to code more, so as I learned I wrote a few apps and sold them. None sold super well, but hey, a bit of extra beer money while you're learning isn't a bad thing :)
Later though I got better, and mixed in the demo stuff I'd learned - processing live camera data with GLSL. I started making pretty decent money then, quit my day job, and I'm still doing that.
Dunno how it pays compared to enterprise stuff. I'd guess similar over say 1 year, but a lot more unpredictable, like one month I can earn just enough to cover the bills, then I can earn the same amount in 1 day. (That, sadly, never lasts ;)
