pouët.net

I think it also to do with the culture of european expressionistic art, coming from the 19th and early 20th century, which the demoscene is influenced by. Dali, van Gogh, Picasso. Maybe the demoscene art is also an evolutionary process of that old european culture of art.

Gloom: just to make it clear, I never said nor meant to say "Arabs don't see the point". I also agree with you that saying something like that is very idiotic and prejudice.
I'm saying something similar to what marmakoide does: basically, there are cultures (such as American, China, Israeli and Arabian) where focus is given to productivity (money wise) over recreational activity.

marmakoide: pushing students for a demoscene involvement is an interesting idea.

Salinga: the demoscene is most definitely, as a whole, NOT influenced by classic painters and artists, but rather pop-cultural copies and references of them in the 80s and 90s.

Trying to make us bigger and more important than we really are is clearly self-delusion and should stop right now.

TLM: introducing students to the demoscene has been done for 20 years with any real tangible results. The scene is like any hobby -- a certain number of criteria must be met in order for it to "click" for someone and get into it. This is the same as it ever was, except now the world is filled with demoscene-like stuff that's way easier to get started with, and hence demoscene "recruitment" is at an all-time low.

There is no magic trick to getting people interested in the scene, it's just a simple numbers-game.

just attach a price-tag to your prods and they will be copied and spread all over the world ;D

TLM: nope you are pretty much wrong, there are so many activities which they have nothing to do with "focus is given to productivity (money wise)" and yes demoscene or art is not considered part of it due the difference in cultures.

sorry. what? LOL!

if you fix the "i wanna do something demoscene'ish but i dont wanna do it alone" thing in those countries, they could very well establish a local scene. And, having two random fucking talented Arabs collaborating with some random outreaching Norwegians and a few beer drinking Belgians does not help establishing a local scene. So then there isn't one. ;)

@TLM Well, I did not ask my students "okay, make me a demo" ^^ They have to work on a year long project. It's often things like "code a forum in PHP" or "or program that textbook subject X on architecture Y". I just choose topics with a potential for artistic output : a sequencer coupled to a softsynth, a framework to code & compile raymarched scenes, procedural content generation, etc. I develop my own version in parallel of their, and taunt them "hey, look, in 64 ko it does more than your 16Mo, maybe you can do better ?". I try to make my own version look sleek, to give them a goal and some emulation. I show them related demos for the same purpose. In my wildest dream I wish they would push up to demoable-level. But not quite there yet :D

Maali has leading: the lack of necessity for a geographical context to make demos has completely killed the concept of "A Norwegian demogroup", since everyone works with everyone.

The demoscene was literally influenced by the tackiest of tacky shit from the 80s and 90s (Boris Valejo, Airbrushed tits Italo Disco, Eurodance)

i feel mostly influenced by Warhol and Duchamp

My main inspiration is Skrillex. He truly changed rock and roll 4 ever.

Just so we don't forget

and gloom, no.. you topsy turvy it. the problem with it is that they NEED a LOCAL geographical context to actually HAVE a local scene. which, as you point out, is kind of deminishing from the scene generally and turning into globalized art orgies thanks to modernday intarwebs and a shrinking talent pool to fish from ;)

Maali: exactly. :) Why work with the idiot next door just so you can have a "Norwegian" group when you can work with the genius from Australia and make a far better prod? This isn't negative, this is positive. :)

There is no "Norwegian scene" or "Austrian scene" or "Arab scene", it's just "the scene", with various people living in various countries.

still. this IS a hurdle for newcomers, whose obvious first step is to look around in their own backyard.. again cos of the 'i dont wanna do this stuff alone'-thing and well as the word "scene" implies.

gloom: language barrier.

Maali: I disagree. In a world where people discover everything online (TV shows, music, movies, books, hobbies etc.) I don't agree that something local is (possible) newcomers first contact with the scene. Discoverability for demos is clearly higher online than at your local school, library or media club.

Gargaj: that too.

im not talking about the first contact part.. im talking about the step after discovery and actually being assed to perhaps do a thing or two in that area. And just walking around at an European demoparty as a talented Arab doesnt guarantee a Norwegian demogroup would ask me to do shit :P

Maali, Gloom: personally I don't feel the "global" aspects of the scene as you describe it, I have often felt that I would probably be more active if I had more guys around me to push each other around...
However, keep in mind that I'm just playing "what if" here

TLM: _that_. the "global" aspects you can see in e.g. FLT as a very good example of that, but agreed, doesnt apply for everyone

Maali: sorry, then I misunderstood you. And yes, clearly being able to actually meet people is the glue of the scene -- hence: parties.

I apologies (again) for the spelling/grammar mistakes - as I said before - I'm dyslectic.
I do, however, always interested in getting better, so feedback is always welcomed.

i lost the track of this thread <_>'

well, do you know any sceners in arab countries?