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I seriously hope you choke to your fucking death on your newly-acquired 'democracy' and 'freedom', you ex-warsaw pact 'fellas'.

@bhead: what?

Bhead, you seem like a very nice, intelligent, deep minded bloke with a high definition of social behavour. All I can say that I really admire your erudition, and we could learn a lot from your statements! Thank you!

bhead, it's not that topic. i know that this sounds odd at pouet: serious posts with arguments, please!

Ger: No matter what Tomcat did before, damaging public property is still not a valid excuse to search his house and to put him in prison for atleast 30 days. If his previous acts justify that then why didn't they do it before?

And btw, even in a democracy, riots are sometimes justified (don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that that is the case in this example). But let's give the obligatory quote again:



(Thomas Jefferson, 1787)

Beating up roma people, now that's a fascist move!

sorry to all offended, but all this shit just makes me too mad. I'll stay from that topic from now on. peace.

(off to shit on some hungarian monuments)

@Ger: it's hard to accept, but whatever Tomcat did till now was mostly inside the borders of legitimacy. He's very radical in some cases, and I can't agree with everything he does, but he has a lot of valid points too. And you're somewhat blurring facts, I can't recall Tomcat beating up gipsies. In fact, he was beaten by gipsies infront of TV cameras on a rally where gipsies wanted to prove how peaceful they are.

Adok: pfff, sovietism could not be seriously considered as a concrete application of socialism, it should rather be seen as a red fascism.

and capitalism doesn't give a fuck to collectivism (I'm not saying that capitalism hasn't bought any social progress).

:((

Tomcat beating up graffity taggers? Also describing that in his blog? Hmm, I may have bad memory but however hard I try, can't remember such things... I'm not 100% sure, but why would he do that anyway?

Now that I checked his blog entry about the taggers, he indeed whammed a dude who was scrabbling on a building with a marker. Doesn't that counts as damaging a public property as well? :) Anyway, tagging ugly shit on the wall is definitely not graffity.

I wonder how many monuments in Russia praise the heroic Hungarian soldiers who died on the eastern front?
Bhead, there's really no need to react like that. Please understand that Hungary was occupied by the Russian army, not liberated. If it was liberated, they would come, keep eye on gouverment change and go away, leaving everyone satisfied and exempted from Szálasi's hungarism. But they stood there for 50 years, providing a very miserable life for the whole country. They also actively participated in beating down the rise in '56, not to mention constant political executions. Those crimes are still burried deep in the sould of the nation. So, I think it's absolutely undersandable why some people are not too fond of a homage in the center of Budapest, to the army which is associated to values that directly or indirectly enslaved, opressed and killed their family members...

Sparcus: Fascism is a type of socialism - not every socialist is a fascist.

adok, try to drop the totalitarism-theory for a change.

and of coure, while condemning tomcats political actions, i also absolutely condemn police brutality. tomcats and athinas treatment by the police is outrageous.

totalitarism theory would say socialism is a type of fascism. adok is just spitting plain bullshit.

jailbird, you forgot that tomcat in fact wanted to get beaten up by gypsys, he only went there to provoce that, in a tshirt saying "its forbidden to beat gypsies"

and a bit more about tomcat's blog, I was amused by one of the entrys which was all about how he meet one of my friends while applying to a job at some mobile company, and the all entry was about how lame that guy was and how wise tomcat was... I've asked my friend, and he proved that they have meet there indeed but the rest of the story was a total nonsense bullshit.

or how about that I've accidentally heard at arok 2005 that tomcat was bullshitting about how holocaust havent happened, he thinks it's just a lie, and how he will go to auschwitz, and take sampels from the gas chambers wall to prove there was no zyklon b used....

This turned into the most horribly depressing topic ever, even compared to the main subject.

Bhead: I guess I'm not the one to apologize for what happened, but please do not judge a whole nation from the acts of a few.

what gargaj said :(

In USA they solved the problem by having 2 political parties :D

I vote for people, not partys. I think. Maybe.

0) dipswitch:
you clearly don't have a fucking clue of what the situtation is in Hungary (or in the rest of the world...), so please stfu.

1) Adok:

according to A WEBSITE!!!! OMG!!! (and please, see above)

2) Gem:

You know as well as me, that this is simply not true. Basicly we have only two choices: left or right. There are no other choices. If there were like 10 main parties, it would be true. But there are only 2 of them. (cc to xernobyl. quite the opposite of what you think)

3) on Tomcat:
Please stay ontopic. This is the first serious thread on pouet since years. And this topic isn't about the personality of Tomcat, although he is somewhat related to the events.

Here's a much more accurate transcript of Gyurcsány's speech:

"There isn't much choice. There isn't, because we fucked it up. Not a little--a lot. No European country has ever done something as boneheaded as we have. It can be explained. Obviously we lied through the previous year-and-a-half to two years. It was perfectly clear that what we said isn't true. We are past the country's opportunities by further than we could ever have imagined that the joint governing of the Hungarian Socialist Party and the liberals could cause. And during that, by the way, we did nothing for four years. Nothing. None of you can say a single meaningfully governmental action that we can be proud of, beyond the fact that we pulled the governing back out of the shit by the end. Nothing. If we have to give account to the country, what we did for four years, what will we say? Naturally the thing was not built up nicely, calmly, gradually. No. No. It is being made in a mad dash, because for a while we could not do it, lest it get found out; and now we have to do it so rotten fast that it is killing us. And slowly we are falling over. We cannot take the pace any faster."

Ha-ha.