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Is Demopaja lame or not?

category: general [glöplog]
One day you are running me down for using Demopaja and you say it is lame and thumb down for not being coded. Then the next day 2 demos made in demopaja get top places at the assembly and evryone thumbs em up!

It would be ok if you said our demos was lame cos the design or ideas suck but people say its lame cos we use demomakers. Same shit with out amigo intros.

Aint that just hypocritcal???
today i thought about downloading demopajja, then the moppi guy answered that you have to use their builtin renderer.. then i skipped download it..

however, if demopaja supported 100% plugins (including rendering) maybe we could see more wellsynched demos.. =)

making synch guis sucks!
added on the 2003-08-15 03:53:17 by Hatikvah Hatikvah

Another (the better) one of the demopaja-demos was made by the makers of demopaja(moppi).
added on the 2003-08-15 08:25:17 by teel teel
Kind of agree with Shane.....
added on the 2003-08-15 08:51:15 by mempheria mempheria
Stefan, what do you mean by "if demopaja supported 100% plugins (including rendering)" ???

The whole 3D engine was made by DSD, and only some "misc. effects" used the standard demopaja plugins. You can do whatever you like in demopaja, as you are given full access to the framebuffer and OpenGL in a plugin.

Fore me, demopaja is simply a replacement for a selfmade scripting system, that would deliver sync. parameters to the various effects. But it's so much easier for the GFX crew to put everything together using a visual tool than making a text script.
added on the 2003-08-15 09:23:59 by mri mri
Sorry, I meant:

In Legomania the whole 3D engine was made by DSD...
added on the 2003-08-15 09:25:38 by mri mri
you are lame shane.
added on the 2003-08-15 10:15:57 by gloom gloom
I think using a demo maker is kind of lame. But if you want to make some demos and can't code, and can't find a coder, what choice do you have? It's either demo maker or video...

So i think if you have to use it, then just do it. Criticising demos made in demopaja just cause that's how they were made sucks, unless the demo was made by some uber-coder :) Then again, making a sucking demo with a demo maker would be really lame.
added on the 2003-08-15 10:54:30 by psonice psonice
If you can`t code yourself and you want to make a demo, find a coder to work with. Why not join a group or start your own group? If everyone just started to make demos via demo making tools what would the scene be? Not a place I would want to be.

added on the 2003-08-15 11:15:40 by darkus darkus
ayone want to form a group? :-)
added on the 2003-08-15 11:23:53 by mempheria mempheria
mri/anyone: would there be a chance that i could make it groove on D3D? never looked at it, perhaps i should, shifter has always been nagging me about it :)

added on the 2003-08-15 11:31:30 by superplek superplek
Trackers and other music editor software are lame too. We REAL MEN don't need tools like that, we CODE our demo music. Having a USER INTERFACE in that kind of stuff is just plain lame because anyone can use it!!!!!!
Viznut is correct. ALL HAIL VIZNUT!
added on the 2003-08-15 11:41:06 by teel teel
Darkus: nice idea, but not always practical. Some of us don't have time to put much work into a demo. And i think that's one sure way to piss the other members of a group off :)

Would you want to code a nice demo, only to wait 2 years for the graphics? Then have it criticised for being too old school?

So I think demo makers are the only way to go for some of us.
added on the 2003-08-15 11:44:42 by psonice psonice
damn, i guess i have to answer this seriously now.. :) demopaja works as a "script-engine" also, you don't have to use the included routines if you don't want to. a great way to make people learn the tricks of the trade (= more sceners) and it's alot easier to DRAW the course of an object through a scene than to put random coordinates into the code and hope nothing clips. :)
added on the 2003-08-15 11:45:09 by gloom gloom
plek, there is a D3D "driver" parallel to the OpenGL "driver" in there, but I don't think Memon has kept it up-to-date as there has not been any requests for it, yet. Though, Memon is a nice and helpful guy, so I guess if people really want D3D he will eventually update it...
added on the 2003-08-15 11:46:49 by mri mri
sounds good to me. i'll look into it anytime soon.
added on the 2003-08-15 12:34:21 by superplek superplek
memon told me you couldnt make a renderer plugin/driver, just effect plugins etc.. but its OK... started sketching own synch crap shit tonight hehe
added on the 2003-08-15 13:19:20 by Hatikvah Hatikvah
I had long good reply to this, but the form expired. Too bad... shorter answer.

ShanetheWolf, I though you were kidding on your comment on "ix". If you cannot download the Demopaja and maybe the SDK too and see your self what it's all about, why flame us? You have heard? If you cannot judge yourself, I think you're a sheep, not wolf.

Once upon a time I started my demo career with Red Sector Demomaker. Oh boy, the exitement whe I got my first font done for the sinus scroller. It was heaven :) I want to let the other newbiest getting into scene to have the same sensation I had.

But not only that, Demopaja is a usable application and demo framework. You can extend it quite a lot. It's possbile to write driver and effects plugins for it (the dirvers are harder to write so you need to consult me if you wantto make one). The demopaja works as any scrupting system scheduling your effects, and managing your files. That's what demopaja is all about. Then there's the evil GUI with allows you to easily sync and tweka your effects.

I you say that demopaja is bad and lame, you should also bad any other program which is used to make the demo. Demopaja does not make your demo good, it does nothing automatically, and it does not anything you could not get done with your favorite Pascal compiler. It just makes the demo composition easier, that's what it is made for.

Assumption is the mother of all fuck ups... applies to this thread too. Take your time and download the demopaja and see yourself ;) or email me, and I do my best replying.

p.s. The new D3D driver is coming, there's been some interest on it :)
added on the 2003-08-15 16:17:31 by memon memon

i don't think theres any issue about demopaja being lame. It rules (of course it could be better, which is why you should keep working on it!!)

I think the lame part is people using it to make demos, without coding anything at all. Perhaps i'm wrong, but i just find that a bit lame, just like ripping music or gfx or stealing ideas. Which is funny really, cause i'm using it to make a demo myself, with no code added :)

Whether it's lame or not, a lot of people don't have much choice but to use a demo tool, and it's certainly a great way to start (I remember using red sector's demo maker too, plus others :)
added on the 2003-08-15 16:55:17 by psonice psonice
Memon: he WAS joking. We LOVE Demopaja! It's the best program ever! But Shane was saying that sceners keep saying it is lame even if the demo is awesome (IX is awesome!).

I dont think he meat to flame you he was flaming sceners who say Demopaja is lame and he is makeing a point how stupid it is to thumb down cool demos just because it uses a demo maker like a lot of sceners do.
added on the 2003-08-15 17:22:23 by Tongue Tongue
psionice: you could always learn to code...
added on the 2003-08-15 17:23:32 by psenough psenough
ps: Beleive me, I have tried. Tried and failed. I can get so far, and then I just hit a solid wall of failure. I've tried asm, hex, c6 basic, amiga basic (various types), smalltalk, pascal, jscript, java, perl...

I think my limit is batch scripting, and basic perl scripting. I'm just not made for programming. Which is annoying, cause if i could just break through that barrier, i think i could be quite good. If people have problems with their code, I can quite often tell them whats wrong with it. But not fix it ;(
added on the 2003-08-15 17:30:50 by psonice psonice
I want to ask, is there a plugin for Demopaja that lets you use animated gifs?
added on the 2003-08-15 17:33:31 by Tongue Tongue
I like from Demopaya. Meaning is, whyever i have found good things for pc also, I am in a will to do things. And that much of it! Perhaps I can do a few more things when I am in fully understanding with this.


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