The Demoscene might not be about limitations anymore
category: general [glöplog]
The trend we're clearly seeing is: Removing limits, not Demoscenish celebrating them and working within them. Where's the actual beating the limits? Where's the grit and personality and expression, as opposed to slick and popular?
It's fear. Everyone so afraid of not winning, going for the popular and slick and not the progressive, feared to not be appreciated for the achievement. If you did well, you will be appreciated by me. Don't be afraid.
And where's the achievement with these forces (datalumps, gigabytes of APIs and frameworks despite DosBox running at fantasy-CPU speeds, replay, non-realtime, using the best tools available, using AI to help you even if you know how to code, overly powerful compression to fit old stale size limits that should be lowered).
Didn't we have fun working actually within the limits? Don't the limits breed creativity anymore? I just think they still do! :)
Isn't the truth that many sceners blame lack of time as grownups to warrant being lazy and taking advantage of powerful tools and too-generous size limits etc in compos?
This has been on my mind lately.
Things have changed around prods over decades, but we're bearded old men stuckin our way apparently, and so we're not changing the limits of the prods. Are we really about proving whose compo machine runs the fastest? Isn't that insane?
With this, by limiting tools and sizes, the cheating winners, the animation replays (Bad Apple by any other name, if you would stink as foul), the AI users are placed in the PD, not Demoscene category. I'm being provocative here to crank out some arguments why this view (updating limits including sizes and tools with the times, after decades) is wrong from a creativity standpoint.
It's fear. Everyone so afraid of not winning, going for the popular and slick and not the progressive, feared to not be appreciated for the achievement. If you did well, you will be appreciated by me. Don't be afraid.
And where's the achievement with these forces (datalumps, gigabytes of APIs and frameworks despite DosBox running at fantasy-CPU speeds, replay, non-realtime, using the best tools available, using AI to help you even if you know how to code, overly powerful compression to fit old stale size limits that should be lowered).
Didn't we have fun working actually within the limits? Don't the limits breed creativity anymore? I just think they still do! :)
Isn't the truth that many sceners blame lack of time as grownups to warrant being lazy and taking advantage of powerful tools and too-generous size limits etc in compos?
This has been on my mind lately.
Things have changed around prods over decades, but we're bearded old men stuckin our way apparently, and so we're not changing the limits of the prods. Are we really about proving whose compo machine runs the fastest? Isn't that insane?
With this, by limiting tools and sizes, the cheating winners, the animation replays (Bad Apple by any other name, if you would stink as foul), the AI users are placed in the PD, not Demoscene category. I'm being provocative here to crank out some arguments why this view (updating limits including sizes and tools with the times, after decades) is wrong from a creativity standpoint.
Idk what you’re talking about, still plenty of limits around and nobody’s forcing you to go outside of them
I disagree AI is without limitations. The token prices are quite steep these days ;)
Transhuman/Pachinkoland and generation x are running on a single 880kb floppy disk with custom format and compression tricks and even imbed a custom copy tool to copy the disk and run it on real hardware. That's even trickier to run them on emulators and Transhuman/Pachinkoland even detects if you run it from an emulator or from the real hardware.
Charlie about generation x:
Therefore I don't get your point about "removing the limits" when these two are clearly pushing the limits of real floppy disks.
Charlie about generation x:
Quote:
This was the first demo had to I run from a physical floppy for compo recording after many many years. But this time it was for a very good reason. Luckily the drive in my A500 was still up to the task.
Therefore I don't get your point about "removing the limits" when these two are clearly pushing the limits of real floppy disks.
Abled people who are still into this scene should perhaps seek greener pastures, as this is clearly not the place to meet the best and brightest. :-)
Don't give damn about what people on the internet think. They don't give you 5 minutes of their time, they don't keep a machine running for your platform, they don't read the supplied documentation, they watch your demo on a PC in fast forward from US web servers, and then they show up at Pouet with foam at their mouths. :-)
Don't give damn about what people on the internet think. They don't give you 5 minutes of their time, they don't keep a machine running for your platform, they don't read the supplied documentation, they watch your demo on a PC in fast forward from US web servers, and then they show up at Pouet with foam at their mouths. :-)
