mp4
category: general [glöplog]
kb: I'll give it a test, see how it goes. It didn't struggle at all with 1080p30 (cpu usage was pretty low, under 30% if i remember right), so I just assumed it'd work fine :) I have a radeon 2600 card, which has hardware h264 decoding, so I guess it comes down to whether that will handle it, or if now if it will pass part of the load of the cpu instead of just dumping the lot.
Right, time to download a <30 second long demo that supports high enough res.. tactical battle loop?
Right, time to download a <30 second long demo that supports high enough res.. tactical battle loop?
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(i must bed one of the three persons dumb enough to have registered the Win version)
Your taste in men has plummeted :)
psionice: obligatory Antifact capture request.
psonice: fearmoths - john thaw win32
pete: your proudest moment! I'm not taking requests here btw ;)
Shifter: I'm pretty pressed for time on the windows bit (got a big pile of linux stuff to learn and some web development to get through), but if it runs in vmware and you have somewhere i can upload it to i'll see what can be done. (It'd need to be just basic dx8 level 3d I think - no shaders or anything fancy)
Shifter: I'm pretty pressed for time on the windows bit (got a big pile of linux stuff to learn and some web development to get through), but if it runs in vmware and you have somewhere i can upload it to i'll see what can be done. (It'd need to be just basic dx8 level 3d I think - no shaders or anything fancy)
You can use Avidemux to encode to h.264/AAC and mux to MP4 files directly. Though there are still some quirks (swapped colors with huffyUV) and instabilities, its a really good piece of software...
Don't forget to mux in information like group, title, year and so on...
Don't forget to mux in information like group, title, year and so on...
this is the demoscene dudes, not the applescene!
What does h264 and mp4 has to do with Apple? Ah wait, quicktime supports the format and codec. Right right! It probably it's the VLCscene too, oh shit!
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Is mp4 really a format or is it just an avi renamed?
no, it's a mov renamed.
renamed, fixed, documented and made an official ISO standard, that is.
I got some h264 questions.
Is there a codec to download somewhere that can be used with virtualdub, adobe premiere?
What media-player is best for showing high-res h264 content?
Does it matter in playability what container it is stored in? *.avi *.mkv *.mp4 ?
Is there a codec to download somewhere that can be used with virtualdub, adobe premiere?
What media-player is best for showing high-res h264 content?
Does it matter in playability what container it is stored in? *.avi *.mkv *.mp4 ?
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MPEG-4 Part 14 was based on Apple’s QuickTime container format.[1] MPEG-4 Part 14 is essentially identical to the QuickTime MOV format, but formally specifies support for Initial Object Descriptors (IOD) and other MPEG features.[2]
that's what it has to do with Apple..
r0XX0r: it'd rather matter when dealing with tools.
and i would say that mkv is the next scene standard.
and i would say that mkv is the next scene standard.
Zest: if we all were Russian hentai lovers, you might be right. Considering the actual reality tho i'd heavily doubt MKV finds any adoption within the scene.
Signs look pretty good for .mp4 as standard currently, I'd say.
Signs look pretty good for .mp4 as standard currently, I'd say.
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Is there a codec to download somewhere that can be used with virtualdub, adobe premiere?
The x264 project is here. Windows builds are here.
Currently VirtualDub is best used with VFW codec, but the x264 VFW support was dropped, because the VFW system is too limited. You can still find VFW builds here though.
The Avidemux for stuff you'd do with VirtualDub. It looks very promising and has support for a lot of codecs and containers.
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What media-player is best for showing high-res h264 content?
I found VLC uses less CPU than QT. But I have a card without H.264 acceleration...
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Does it matter in playability what container it is stored in? *.avi *.mkv *.mp4 ?
MP4 is the preferred format. Use it. It is better. Also, when using VBR audio there's no way around it (or mkv)...
What's that preview button for anyway? ;)
Thank you, rarefluid!
kb: i've seen far more HD movies using the matroska container than the apple one, the times when it was used only by anime fansubs are gone... and to my eyes .mp4 is used mainly for podcasts and psp movies.
see in #Content in Matroska in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matroska
besides it's the free format that emerged from the open-source world and doom9.org forum, that's the one the scene should second and use :p
see in #Content in Matroska in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matroska
besides it's the free format that emerged from the open-source world and doom9.org forum, that's the one the scene should second and use :p
Something named after wooden russian puppets shouldn't have any future at all ;)
Finally got a bit of time to test \o/ And tactical battle loop doesn't support 1080 modes /o\ CNS' duality demo had to do, as it was short and ran at full res (but weirdly! It rotates the screen 180 degrees while it runs - and I see windows rotate before the screen clears too! The demo runs upside down, but it captures the right way up :)
So anyway, I did a full 1920x1080x60fps capture, and converted to mp4 with h264/aac with quicktime. 5mb bitrate... played fine, looked shit. 30mb bitrate... played fine, looked fine! \o/ Tried playing under osx... plays 'almost' fine, some bits are smooth but it stutters a bit on scene changes. I'm guessing that's due to the osx gpu drivers not supporting h264 decode acceleration perhaps? I was getting 40-60fps during most of the clip, dropping to about 20 at scene changes, according to quicktime.
Anyway, 1080p demo capture playback is possible at 60fps on modern hardware. For reference, I'm on an imac with 2.8ghz core 2 duo, 4gb ram, and a radeon 2600 xt. The radeon card supports full h264 decoding in hardware, at least on windows, although I did notice something very odd. On windows, I'm getting around 80% CPU usage during playback, while on osx I see around 60% - but it's smooth on windows, not on osx. Guess it must be limited by one thread at some point.
Any recommendations for bitrate? 30mb/sec looked pretty much perfect, but it's 100mb for 30 seconds so you're looking at perhaps 1gb per demo, which is a bit much :) That was a pretty random high number, with single pass encoding as a test, what would be good for a 2-pass encode with high quality? And does playback speed improve with lower bitrates? (having to reboot into windows to watch a capture is pretty pointless if I can just watch the demo directly!)
So anyway, I did a full 1920x1080x60fps capture, and converted to mp4 with h264/aac with quicktime. 5mb bitrate... played fine, looked shit. 30mb bitrate... played fine, looked fine! \o/ Tried playing under osx... plays 'almost' fine, some bits are smooth but it stutters a bit on scene changes. I'm guessing that's due to the osx gpu drivers not supporting h264 decode acceleration perhaps? I was getting 40-60fps during most of the clip, dropping to about 20 at scene changes, according to quicktime.
Anyway, 1080p demo capture playback is possible at 60fps on modern hardware. For reference, I'm on an imac with 2.8ghz core 2 duo, 4gb ram, and a radeon 2600 xt. The radeon card supports full h264 decoding in hardware, at least on windows, although I did notice something very odd. On windows, I'm getting around 80% CPU usage during playback, while on osx I see around 60% - but it's smooth on windows, not on osx. Guess it must be limited by one thread at some point.
Any recommendations for bitrate? 30mb/sec looked pretty much perfect, but it's 100mb for 30 seconds so you're looking at perhaps 1gb per demo, which is a bit much :) That was a pretty random high number, with single pass encoding as a test, what would be good for a 2-pass encode with high quality? And does playback speed improve with lower bitrates? (having to reboot into windows to watch a capture is pretty pointless if I can just watch the demo directly!)
psionice i'd recommend mpeg video (xvid etc.) for high bitrates rather than h264. h264 is for youtube and psp, but most disagree :)
mpeg video => mpeg4 video
i hate weighted companion cubes
er, h264 achieves the same quality with 20-50% less bitrate with virtually all samples i've tried. not using it is just stupid if you have to pay for your bandwidth :)
psionice, with high bitrates the main bottleneck is cpu power. while per-pixel processing can be easily accelerated using graphics hardware, bitstream decoding is still done on CPU, and it easily becomes the bottleneck with high-bitrate applications (especially since it's serial by nature). CABAC is quite a bit more cpu-hungry than non-CABAC (CAVLC) encoding, so you might want to turn it off if you're targeting high bitrates (note that CAVLC needs about 10% more bitrate for the same quality compared to CABAC; also, i'm not sure whether quicktime even supports CABAC encoding). 30mbit sounds excessive - the captures i've tried look quite good at 2.5mbit (800x600, 60fps), and for some of the samples i haven't been able to achieve comparable quality with xvid even at 3.6mbit (deities in particular is a codec-killer :). for 1080p@60hz with demo material, i'd try something in the range of 8-16mbit (start at 12 and do a binary search :).
psionice, with high bitrates the main bottleneck is cpu power. while per-pixel processing can be easily accelerated using graphics hardware, bitstream decoding is still done on CPU, and it easily becomes the bottleneck with high-bitrate applications (especially since it's serial by nature). CABAC is quite a bit more cpu-hungry than non-CABAC (CAVLC) encoding, so you might want to turn it off if you're targeting high bitrates (note that CAVLC needs about 10% more bitrate for the same quality compared to CABAC; also, i'm not sure whether quicktime even supports CABAC encoding). 30mbit sounds excessive - the captures i've tried look quite good at 2.5mbit (800x600, 60fps), and for some of the samples i haven't been able to achieve comparable quality with xvid even at 3.6mbit (deities in particular is a codec-killer :). for 1080p@60hz with demo material, i'd try something in the range of 8-16mbit (start at 12 and do a binary search :).
actually, scratch the "virtually", the range "20-50%" is as big as it is precisely because it includes all samples i've tried :)
anes: more disk space wasted for the same quality? Think I'll stick with h264 unless I have serious issues with playback.. it's looking like it'll work out fine with a bit of tweaking.
ryg: thanks, not sure I understand all of that, but I got most of it. Last time I really read up on video encoding was in the early mpeg2 days, and I've forgotten most of that :) As a quick calculation, I have 4x more pixels to encode than your 800x600 captures so 10mbit sounds like a good place to start.
A quick look into whether qt supports CABAC tells me it does... then it tells me it doesn't. Ah, the joy of finding reliable info on the net :) I'll check the options out anyway, it doesn't matter either way if there's no option to change it there.
ryg: thanks, not sure I understand all of that, but I got most of it. Last time I really read up on video encoding was in the early mpeg2 days, and I've forgotten most of that :) As a quick calculation, I have 4x more pixels to encode than your 800x600 captures so 10mbit sounds like a good place to start.
A quick look into whether qt supports CABAC tells me it does... then it tells me it doesn't. Ah, the joy of finding reliable info on the net :) I'll check the options out anyway, it doesn't matter either way if there's no option to change it there.