pouët.net

I don't have much in the way of entirely new ideas, but I think some refinement of the file archive function would be nice...

Scene.org currently has a huge file archive which, although organised to some extent, is very unfriendly for browsing for what you want.
For example, if ever you want to search for a prod, or even something simple like viewing all prods for one group, you have to use Pouet's janky search/listing functionality, which would then link back to scene.org.
If you are browsing a party releases directory, the filenames are cryptic so you have to click on each nfo file in turn.

No problem with that as an FTP archive, but if we could have a database full of file paths in the FTP plus a tonne of metadata, and a website to search it all efficiently, it'd be awesome.

Initially you'd have the pouet-style info, like:
- Demo name
- Release date and party.
- Group
- Platform(s)
- Type (64k, demo, video, etc), but also allowing combinations (like video of 64k)
- Involved people / handles

The reason to have this in scene.org DB is so it can be shown in columns during the directory listing during a browse via HTTP.
Also for search of course.
Anyone with a sceneID could edit this metadata (you might need revision tracking?)

A link back to the pouet prod page would also be nice, or at least just a link to pouets search function for the name.
Being able to display the number of thumbs from the pouet page in the directory listing would be nice too.

In addition to standard fields, a *big* want for me is general 'tags' attached to files. Again, anyone with a sceneID could tag files, and you can search by tags. For example extensive usage of tags see http://danbooru.donmai.us/ (an imageboard, may not be safe for work).

The idea being you associate as many terms as you can think of to a file, which makes looking for similar things much easier, or searching for somethingon a whim easy to do.
Once you have tags there you can also do all sorts of fun stats, and relate prods to each other by common features with a simple DB query.

For example tags, stuff like: fractals, ambient, 3d_flyby, dutch_colour_scheme, cubes, werkzeug, etc etc.
Just anything you could think to associate with a prod. Once some time has passed and people have a good collection of tags, it becomes really fun to use in my experience on other sites.
Of course the whole archive of the past will probably never get tagged much, but it'd still be worth it for newer prods.


Regarding all the stuff above, it'd be nice if before it was launched you seeded things like type/group/party/demo-name it from the pouet DB - you could do a query based on download link I guess?

some part for old hardware should be there, where people can post their questions and answers regarding old hardware.

reviving old machines they bougth on the market. e.g troubleshooting if they get a turquoise screen after connecting the comp to a display device. etc.

well that could be done in some pouet threads, would be a nice feature of the new scene.org, for sure!

The new scene.org shall win an webby

I may already have said this during one of our irc meetings, but I'll restate it here to see what other people think about it:

I think that Scene.org should be more like Amazon.com.

When you visit Amazon, the first thing you see is a bunch of new and hot products which you can buy staring you in the face. On scene.org this should be a bunch of screenshots from new and hot demos which you can download. Also, when browsing through the archive I want to see screenshots, not the boring lists which we have now. People can use an ftp client if they want such lists.

At the left side on Amazon I see a lot of categories which I can chose from to refine the products on the page. Scene.org should have those too. We could have all kind of categories, like platforms, prod types, themes, etc.

One of the good things about Amazon is that it gives you hints like "people who bought this product also bought...". On Scene.org it would be nice to get similar hints, like "people who downloaded this demo also downloaded...".

Also, when you login at Amazon, you get a personalized opening page with products which you may like, based on your past buying history. Scene.org should have something like that too, an opening page with demos which you in particular may like.

I think the pouet rating database in combination with logged downloads (only if the user gave permission for that info to be logged of course) could be used to present such personalized information and hints.

Or more like youtube... or any other commercial webshop... these people know how to sell stuff to people, so we should learn from them...

these people are actully doing biz... :/

actually :)

Well, my point is basically that if whenever someone who hasn't got a clue about the demoscene accidently bumps into scene.org we have to convince him that he wants to get what he sees, and that's a trick webshops are good at :-)

If i didn't know a jack about demoscene i would get rather suspicious if some "organisation" tried to "sell me" some .exe files to run.

stefan: you're trying awfully hard not to understand, don't you? :)

what about some scores involving code, gfx, msx, overall of a demo?

Quisten: Have you ever tried to get someone to run a binary, someone that is completely outside the scene or the like?

stefan, us normal people have actual friends. if you tell a friend to run an exe and guarantee that it's not a virus, he'll believe you.

also, considering he vast amount of slashdotters that downloaded (and, i guess, ran) kkrieger it seems that most people aren't as paranoid as you are. then again, we already knew that. do you sleep well, stefan?

sparcus: just have to ask.. how committed are the scene.org staff to regularly and continuously updating the site? this kind of thing would require a lot of ongoing work. there's nothing worse than setting it all up and then not updating it so it just goes to pot.
if the staff dont have time to update it constantly maybe those kind of ideas should be left out.

smash: I believe many in the staff are eager to see such changes go into effect, but if it turns out not to be so, a group of community moderators can easily handle such things as well.

Offtopic:

Could someone please translate this expression into Dutch please? I'd like to compare these two languages based on that sentence. Some Dutchies know already what I think about their language. ;-)

No, but I can translate it into Norwegian. :) - "Kaste sten i glasshus" is how we say it. Strangely enough, it doesn't become more relevant though.

rene: gooi niet met stenen, want je zit in een kas.

and it's not an expression that i know of. remarkably so, considering the vast amount of greenhouses we have.

I like sparcus's idea. It'd be great for people new to the scene or who don't frequent scene sites all that often to have a place where they can get some kind of "what's hot" type list, with screenshots. A site that makes downloading some fresh demos a bit more appealing would rule. Pouet kind of does it, but for new visitors there's only the BBS which isn't exactly welcoming for first timers, the top 10 all time list and the top of the month list (which rule, but are a down near the bottom of the page and lack screenshots. Also, the montly table varies between great (after a big party) or shit (in a quiet month)).

It shouldn't take that much maintainance once it's running - you can pull the necessary bits of info with a bit of sql to capture the most downloaded demo of the last 24 hours, things like that. It should run itself to a good extent.

What i liked about the old hornet archive and never has been re-done properly up till now:

a commented/rated "dump site" for sourcecode/tutorials/effects.

This is how i got interested in the scene: tons of interesting stuff posted, even with some kind of competition ("wow, check out pascal's new rotozoomer")

Remember MRIs tutorials about texmappers, e.g.?

imho this is also to some extend the reason for lack of newcomers to the scene. You can't learn how to code demo-style on nehe, gamedev, devmaster, whatever. And the current "resources" folder on the server certainly won't cut it.

A section like this on scene.org would be great.

Without decent code there is no demoscene.
Without new coders there is no fresh ideas.
And we need fresh ideas. Badly.

Make scene.org _the_ site for demo-related coding info!

For a better demo world ;-)

jar ftw. that should be there.

What you suggest on this page is basically pouet 2.0 (as in web 2.0) less the tutorials/sourcecode part (great idea indeed).
We have all the info already... Look at your personal thumbs-up agreers... Look what they watched and liked... Why not improve Pouet and let scene.org do the hosting ;)

What rarefluid said. Most of the features suggested would fit better here than over there. I'd rather scene.org stay as a service for demo-related hosting, and not turn into some kind of pouet.

But, Scene.org would be the "serious, moderated and official" site, while Pouet would keep the underground-punk snake-pit attitude every troll loves.