pouët.net

So, the party organisers want the sceners to release prods on their parties. But in the end, they don't care if the results are fair or not.

I think I've mention this a couple of time already... When I used to organise bcnparty, after doing the votecount, if there were something that I felt was unfair, I contacted the jury, or whoever voted and explained the situation to get the thoughs of each one. Usually they changed their minds at the moment (Votes after the first impression are usually wrong). So, at the end of the party I don't remember too many people complaining about the results, and if they did we released the votes of the jury/voters.

So, seems like that's something that no many other parties do. It's not the first time I speak about this.. I think the last one was kindergarten? Well, How come we still have to deal with the "moral winner" thing? Cocoon prod was the winner hands down. These kind of thins may frustrate the creators (and imagine if you got 15th on the demo compo ;D).

After Assembly, I understood why some people don't like to release at parties. And to be honest, besides some exceptions, I can't see why I should release anything in a party. In case I did, I would have to do a stupid crown-pleaser that I don't really like, in fact, that only sceners (and gamers) like.

So, why release at parties then?

Because of the audience. A lot of people won't watch anything that's not from the party, and then there's the party audience as well..

As far as the moral winner thing goes, tough luck. At least you get the satisfaction that people liked your prod. In my eyes, the cocoon prod had no qualities important to me to make it a winner, in my opinion, so fairness is subjective as well. And why would someone care about the rankings, anyway? It's not like they bring you fame, fortune or glory.

(and yeah, I feel that Sokuseki was totally underrated in the competition, it was one of my top 5 candidates. So was the Adapt demo, and the Jumalauta entry that wasn't shown at all. The ones that were placed too high were my own piece of crap and the wamma demo at least.. but that happens, especially at Assembly)

I second Preacher. Nothing beats seeing your prod on the bigscreen with a huge shitload of sceners watching (and hopefully; applauding :)

Ok let's forget about our demo : I completly agree on the adapt demo !
I really think the creators must have been disapointed.

Taking the evoke exemple : I really feel bad for the fresh!Mindworks demo that ranked 8th

and hopefully the prod not breaking spectacularly *cough* :P

The only slightly "unfair" things I can think of are name-voting and agressively fishing for compliments (aka fan-service, pop-culture/retro-computing/gaming references, demo remakes etc.).

The bottom line is: Make your demos interesting enough to stand out, so people remember it when they vote. ;)

I release a few at parties but when I do, it's for the only pleasure of listenning to my tracks on a big speakers.
As I often say, if someone come and greet me because he found my track cute and he really enjoyed that cuteness, i'm the happiest kaneel in the world.

And I actually did laught from the fact I arrived last at evoke tiny tracking compo :)

*cough* Assembly *cough* big screen *cough* LOL *cough*

Gargaj : was really nice compared to other things i saw...
I mean some guys must have at leat spend some time to polish the style ( logos and color scheme )

Again that old rant about "should have won", almost as boring as "Thumb down, not as good as Variform" or "Could have been done in 64k"

Can anybody explain me once and for all why the winning demo won in any unfair way? Were there fake voters? Were the votes tweaked? Did the org change the results?

If this is about personal tastes again, maybe it's time you guys stop acting like bitter/ranting zealots. A majority of people prefered another demo to a Cocoon demo or a Fairlight demo but you did not, so what? Live with it and accept that some people have different tastes when it comes to fun/design/concept/ideas.

Indeed, the winning demo did not use evil shaders with nice modeling and stuff like that, but it has other things the Cocoon demo did not feature. As much as I respect Willbe and the other guys involved in that demo (nice artwork dude, good job), I found the winning demo much more entertaining. That doesn't mean the Cocoon demo was bad or anything, it was just different.

Also, one culprit might be the Assembly voting system. You pick out five demos (three entries on other competitions), and things that have "fun" in them are often picked out by the gamers (like the wamma demo had a remix of a fucking annoying Finnish summer hit).

Nytrik: The Adapt guys were actually pretty happy that they ended up as 10th ;) Their previous group Promille Dezign ended up second to last in the democompo in 2005, as did the Adapt demo in 2006. That despite the demos being a lot better than some other entries in the compo..

Real fake votes might be a thing of the past (probably not) but a lot of people seem to vote based on whether or not the authors are their friends....

*cough* i propose a new *cough* voting system *cough* to solve all our *cough* problems *cough*

Actually, keops is right, it's actually a matter of taste.
end of discussion, kthxbyerz :)

Paris Hilton for president then! !\o/!

"A majority of people prefered another demo to a Cocoon demo or a Fairlight demo but you did not, so what?"
- im pretty sure we didnt enter.

Smash: I was refering to your redundant ranting about Assembly and the Intel compo and you perfectly know it.

here's the thing..
at assembly you _expect_ the voters to vote a certain way - you know the audience is made up of a big mix of gamers, computer enthusiasts and sceners (who are often too wasted to vote for the democompo by the time it ends). it can be a bit disappointing to place low there but you know if you did something at all "out there" it's not going to do amazingly well. but there are parties for that kindof thing where it will do well - altparty and so on.

however, for some reason, at parties which are all sceners you naively expect the voting to be somehow "fair" and objective - judged on the quality in all areas, and not just the entertainment value. it's much more disappointing when it doesnt live up to that there than at assembly.

personally i'd rather enter assembly, knowing full well how it's going to turn out. or enter sundown (*hint*), where there's a reasonably mature all-scener audience who are usually pretty sober when it comes to voting, and relatively unswayable by crowd-pleasing popular references. :D (we dont have any big cash prizes, though, sorry. but the winner demogroup gets a ride in rc55's mate's car!)

keops: i wasnt at all upset by our placing at assembly, actually, and i never said otherwise. although i was disappointed with our 4th in the intel compo, and even you agreed with that.

+: would that be so different form schwarzenegger being gouvernor?

about the results: do you people also complain when some stupid shit tops the music-charts when there is so much better music around? it is the old good/popular difference. the kaki demo was a crowdpleaser so there are really no surprises here.

releasing anything anywhere is just a waste of time.

cp: as far as I knot Arnold is doing quite well... better than Bush.

Smash: indeed I agreed on that, yet I don't make a fuss about it (not talking about you there but about Nytrik and Trace being somehow insulting towards the winners or people doing stuff on oldskool platforms on the other thread), which makes my point even more valid.

That's like saying that a demo is quite good... better than Rush Hour :-)

That whole discussion is actually why I like pouet so much ;)

No, seriously, we all know party voting has its problems. Those problems have been well documented and discussed to death. And one of the results was that it's simple human nature we're trying to argue about here, so the whole ordeal is pretty pointless from the start.

The pouet voting/topofthemonth system on the other hand works pretty well. Especially because if you look at some parties where everyone was complaining about the results afterwards, the "pouet rankings" of the respective prods on the party page show a reasonably different picture of things. And every time there's a good amount of controversy around a prod (Gargaj's and my 4k partyhack springing to mind) this magically boosts popularity and gets the prod out into the !scene's spotlight via the top of the month feature.

So, if you dislike party results and you finally realize they won't go away any time soon, just wait until the dust has settled a bit and look here. So what was the problem again? ;)