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Well, the crew who claims oldschool is to push the hw forward and want demos with new effects etc, declines to get radeon cards borrowed to run in the compomachine, since they want to have a shitty GF4, meaning, new dx9 demos wont run on their compomachines.

So i guess, FR now completly share the Razor1911 idea of how demos should be coded , wich means: crappy :)

I'm not sure there would be a DX9-demo-galore if there would be a Radeon in the compo-machine...

tnt2!

yes or voodoo2 perhaps.. yeah, would fit fr nicely :)

i'm sure the last thing everyone wants is that stupid people start making demos which work only with 50% of people who have bought a new gfx-card during the last three months. in my opinion right now all new pc/windows demos should be made to work with geforce3. if one really wants to use all new dx9 features it isn't a problem as long as it also works on older cards. pixel shaders shouldn't be the whole point of a demo.

ofcourse not, lets go back and make an environmentmapped torus! jaa!! shchöön!! great!! haujobb stylee , jaa!!

but radion owners are so passionate about their cards and they hate nvidia guts!! how can we live with such nnazii'z on the scene!

tnt2 ownz (and i own tnt2)

Oh pleeeeeaaaassee..
Like as if anyone cares ;)

Hm. Face it: TNT2 is *very* slow. But I myself own a GeForce 2 MX, which is simply more or less fast enough, but doesn't have any advanced feature of the following cards.
I'm personally against not letting people with "a bit" older hardware wartch demos. And the "time" has IMO not "come" yet , since these features were not yet standardised by the OpenGL committee.
To put it face up: i'm envious at people who have newer cards, but i'm not going to buy one till the standards are there. And then i'm bying a complying one.
And i'm actually against encouraging NVidia further and would support an alternative if a choice was there.

the standards are here, www.microsoft.com/directx , lamer :)

motto: if it doesn't run on my tnt1 it's coded wrong.
32x overdraw is not the right way to do radial blur even if it runs fine on some insane voodoo3.

216: it very much depends on how the radialblur is gonna be used, if you want a 3dscene blured in a *scene* not as a 2d layer, then , i would say it wouldnt be fast on a tnt1.

i'm all for stefan/lator productions being dx9+radeon only

I dunno, not much has changed.

When the Amiga 3000 was released, the scene stuck to the A500. Even after the launch of the A1200 it took a short while before AGA demos started appearing. In fact, I could never watch early AGA productions because they wouldn't run on my '040 A4000.

Now I have a GeWhizz4, but only one demo makes use of it's shaders technology. This is to be expected so I ain't complaining.

On the other hand, the C64 is still a viable scene platform.

knos: nice to hear you bought a new radeon card :-)

thom: lots of demos uses the old pixelshader functionality, tho its not really that erotic.

Whats the point of making demos that only shows what the HW could do a few years ago.. demos are demonstrations. They are here to impress people, but we have to impress them with a lot less power than the gamemakers have their hands on. Im not totally against the idea that you should be able to run the demo on the few latest cards, but then it will be uglier than on the card it was designed for.. And to have a party ( the place to show off ) to limit the demos to old techniques are just plain stupid.

the debate on who can show the demo are nearly as silly.. often the demos can be on windows OR linux.. and i have no possibillity to show linusdemos here. should they be banned becourse of that reason? and the same goes for gfxcards!

demoscene is about innovation. we're gonna innovate using the amazing power of the new radeons. phear us. 0xFF00FF will now be replaced by [1.0 0.0 1.0] using the amazing floating point pixel pipelines.

radial blur using 16 texture units.

stefan: Nothing's ever good enough for you. Perhaps a change of hobby is in order...?

I thought that the hobby called 'demo-making' was to get the most impressive stuff you can on to the screen, and hopfully much better than the gamemakers does ( i know that they work on it all day, but we just make the effects, they make a whole game :)

its a reason there often exists both oldschool demo competitions and just demo competitions, so that you that think glenzvectors are the pride of demomaking still can watch those even in 2003.. :=)

nothing is impressive without a given context / scale.

sagacity, why, when I can do 64-layer radial blur in 60 fps on gf2mx with a small "recursive" blurring trick (only need six 2-unitmultitextured "blits")?

those 16 units are useful for many other things though.... ;)

where have i heard that recursive so wrongly used before? >D

sounds like a personal problem to me, poor babies