pouët.net

well people seem to find smelly the lack of details about which costs what

and for exactly that reason the whole discussion is a bit of a moot point until dtv specifies where the hell all that cash is going. so lets wait for that.

Yeah, that's what it all comes down to, but for now all we get is a request for 50k, an iphone app that's very cool but promises that in future you'll have to pay for content (which is made by us, not dtv). It's exactly the kind of thing that makes people suspicious and angry :)

I'm guessing the dtv guys just haven't thought things through quite so well as they could have, and just need to re-word a few bits of text to calm people down.

having to pay for the iphone app is ridiculous indeed - unless the cash is used to cover any justifyable expense of running dtv as a whole

but i digress, lets wait for some numbers to appear and then make judgement.

Lets wait forever for numbers to appear...

well dtv guys don't improve the situation by not answering in the questions raised in the threads they opened...

yeah. Some delays in providing figures or answers might be understandable, there's some complex issues at work here.. but they could have told us that and asked us to hold tight for a while. Disappearing doesn't look good :)

maybe they thought 'hey what a shitstorm, screw this'

DTV did alot of nice and good stuff aswell.. Lets wait on there reaction.
I hope some of the "more critical reactions and questions" didnt demotive them.. in the mean time read the article I once wrote together with some DTV blokes:

http://www.hugi.scene.org/online/hugi34/hugi%2034%20-%20demoscene%20reports%20magic%20demoscene.tv%20-%20you%20make%20it,%20you%20read%20it!.htm

Amazing, even here you had to do the usual annoying Hugi spam...

according to that crock of an article from 2008, dtv costs were €20,000/year...

"rewording a few bits" to cover up their true agenda would be deceitful. if nothing else, i commend dtv for their honesty. at least that way the scene can decide based on fact - rather than manipulative and dishonest PR.

they want 50k to pay for equipment and staff salaries and they've got the balls to ask for it. i commend them.

row: it says 20k for running DTV, and 25k for the DTV Tour stuff.

farfar: yeah but they did the tour only once, afaik (in 2006)

magic: just fuck off with your hugi spam, fucking moron.

Can't agree with that. Demoscene is for free and should not cost here and there. Why should demosceners donate for watching the own free demos as videos. Better way is to buy a new graphiccard and watch it realtime !

DemoScene-Services are for free and finance with sponsors or advertising on the webpage. I see SKY TV advertising on DTV. They should pay enough or not?

Equipment needed? Find some Sponsors then!

In my opinion Demoscene-Party-Organizers have to PAY if they want DTV on Stage ! Its the best promotion and Livestreaming for each Demosceneparty and should payed then... Make bigger Entry-Fees then and all Demosceners will accept that i'm sure.

So party attendants should pay higher entrance fees so that sofasceners can watch party livestreams at home? Please don´t count me in ;)

Why not? There're much sceners wich can not travel to each party... DTV is a good option for them... Who care's about 2 or 3 euros more entryfee then ? And if organizers think they won't do that: ok then no money, no DTV on stage... Just my opinion...

I just think, that this donate discussions going on my nerves at all cauz i think that siteowners like DTV should first ask the bigger guys in the scene (PartyOrgas, Sponsors etc) before asking again the small people at pouet without giving more detailed informations...

I have start my little company and could need 50K too as startfinance to buy the equipment i need... Wanna pay for me too? Please send to my Paypal then.. :)

Stop stop daxx.

DTV always wanted money to cover parties.
Why do you think that they boycotted MAIN?
Remember that even BP.TV was only born because DTV let Breakpoint hanging....

Imho, DTV is overrated. Nice Portal, nice concept, but not needed.

Paying DTV for Party coverage?
Raising entrance fees so the real sceners pay for the couchcrowd? Ridiculous...

Its all about realtime Baby.
Bye DTV.(and dont forget to take metapat with you)

As an organizer I prefer to pay the trip to 100 sceners rather than to a business company and organising our own stream.

And IIRC even BPTV had a quite low priority during the fund raising for BP09...not sure though. Partystreams are an extra, which nobody really needs.

Docd, talking this way about DTV ain't respectable.
Why did they boycot MAIN? Seriously, you don't know half of the story.
I'd have wanted to see you showing up at MAIN 2006, on a Friday evening, after 10+ hours of train or car, arriving in an EMPTY party hall, with NOTHING done for the network, internet, partymeister, and so on. What would have been the aim, if you were a member of DTV, to come there and not be able to stream anything? None.
Why BP.TV was born? Seriously, you don't know half of the story either.
You already were in the Breakpoint organizing team iirc, when some "shit" happened. And still, you don't know half of the story.
DTV ain't overrated. Paying them for a party coverage is _normal_. None of us sceners is able to pay for a (or more) streaming/hosting servers, unless you've got your own company.
And metapat is one of the cutest and kindest guy in the scene.
Here. Now, seriously, stop clashing DTV with all that nonsense.

Rowley: ah - yeah okay, fair enough :) 50k euros definitely is a lot of cash, even if you can burn through it pretty quickly over a year. I know booster can arrange hosting stuff for free where he works (an ISP). In general I'm sure there are a lot of options for doing stuff for less moneys and cut costs if that's what's needed.

What I mean is that they're currently asking for money for content more or less with the iphone app - content that they don't own, and don't have permission to charge for, which has caused a lot of anger. There's no major problem with paying some money to cover the expenses they have, so I think they just need to reword it a bit. Same with the request for funding - a bit more info on what for and why and we might all rush to give it to them. Or not, perhaps, we'll have to see.