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Stockhausen was a pioneer in the German musique concrete school. To give you an idea of the discipline and planning he had (and how easy we have it today), go listen to "Song of the Children" and realize that he made that entire thing with 2 tape machines and one fixed pitch oscillator.

So when he wanted a synth sound, he built it up one sine wave at a time by "playing" the oscillator to tape, then playing the tape while adding the next harmonic on top, repeating over and over...so he could have one tiny fragment of sound which he would later splice into another tape. It took YEARS to make pieces, and the level of complexity in his scores is incredible - there are "themes" in pitches, but also durations, panning, timbres, etc.

No two of his pieces are alike, and his writings and thoughts on music are as important as John Cage's. Like many "serious" composers, frequently the IDEAS in his music are more interesting or important than the music itself. I don't put a lot of Stockhausen on for "fun", for the gym, or for dancing, or at dinner, but I do try to listen to much of his work to practice LISTENING.

Robin Maconie has written a number of great books based on Stockhausen interviews. If you can find "Stockhausen on Music", it's well worth owning.

If he's good, he should be able to finely tune the mood provoked by his creations as well as have some ability to keep it appropriate to accompanying audio or visuals. If he is able to reproduce this kind of work and to create a practical record for another artist to reproduce it, that is even better. This is something that could not be done at random. The ability to do this would (or, has been) an important development in musical theory, since it is a useful tool to have available and is part of an overall mastery of sound and emotional response. As someone mentioned in the youtube comments (my god! an insightful comment in a youtube thread), one application of this sort of sound/music is in horror films. It could be applied more covertly and selectively in other productions as well.

Personally, I think the fact that his iconic status caused some ideas and questions to spread is what is most important. I don't particularly like his music as it stands on its own either.. but perhaps it was an inspiration to some people who would not have heard it without him.

Some people in this thread seem to forget that the true essence of art is not HOW you do it, but THAT you do it.

I thought people here were the first to understand that.

Oh, and Buttler, my biggest problem with you (and the reason I really hope you are just trolling us) is the sheer arrogance you displayed in this thread.

Claiming an innovative composer and inventor like Stockhausen is just a 'hack' because you don't understand his music and backing up your musical background with some mediocore porn music shows such an arrogance it's astounding.

Several people have tried to explain the essence of Stockhausen's importance, and you just blew everything in the wind with the comment 'but it sounds completely out of tune'.

The ignorance and arrogance you displayed in this thread showed that you never ever should critic any art and that any opinion you may ever have is instantly void.

Okkie brings the truth train! SLAM! :)

In this case, it seems to me to be a sort of experimentation as well. It's difficult to criticize people for experimentation unless they've crossed some kind of ethical line.. and I see no reason to believe that he did. If he hadn't done it and become famous for it, then I suspect that another person with a strong musical background may have done it soon enough (the time was ripe for it). I don't consider that to be a criticism, since when it comes to exploration or experimentation, I appreciate any work that has been done toward exploring different lines.

some of the stockhausen influenced music:

Miles Davis

Can

The Beatles

I think that may be a wee bit harsh on the guy :) (Buttler). I think a lot of us had to come to the horrible realization that the fields we once considered ourselves to be experts in turn out to be ridiculously and hopelessly deep.. and so amongst those who have devoted their lives to a different path, even the ones who are the 'worst' in our judgment are in some way or another literally decades ahead of us in understanding and are continuing to widen the gap. I think humility follows arrogance more than the other way around.

I'll simplify this...

The music I posted here took months to write and produce, yet I could create Stockhausen style sounds on the spot.

If you walk into a music class at any primary school, you will hear kids mashing and plucking instruments and making the same kind of sounds as Stockhausen.

It confuses me when I see how he (supposedly) influenced all these great composers and bands, when all these artists' music is in tune, follows convention and none of it sounds remotely like Stockhausen.

I'll spare us any jokes about how slow you seem to work and simplify this even more:

DO.

Let's see if whatever comes out can stand any comparative analysis.

kb has leading.

Ok, I was maybe exaggerating a lot about the time period my music takes as I often write many tracks over time.

But one thing I do want to point out is that Stockhausen's sound IS NOT ORIGINAL! It sounds like any clueless kid with a musical instrument, it sounds like random mashing of instruments. That is not original.

Original would be the first rock track, the first dance tracks, the first jazz tracks...music where nothing like it has ever been heard before, and yet still adheres to the fundamentals!

Ok, I have a challenge for you. Can you tell me what makes Stockhausen better or more musical than this guy?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9_nrQQV6dBQ

I have a challenge for you too: would you troll the same way with your other account too? :)

name him and shame him!!! :)

... this thread is fucking stupid. bring on bjerte!

Yeah, clearly, fuck Shane!

i didn't mean shane :)

I think UKSCENE is clearly weird :(

Gargaj: Would you like to tell everyone on Pouet that you monitor their IP addresses? :)

Also,

A) I'm not trolling. I'm making valid points and getting personal insults thrown back at me. It's ironic that you're talking about a man who was controversial and unconventional, yet you can't accept anyone who doesn't agree with the majority.

B) >I< don't have another Pouet account. During the last 3 months I've had at least 5 different sceners/ex-sceners use this computer, including Dunx, Wade, Frost, and Screech. I think Red Devil too, or maybe just his brother.

What's wrong with that ? It's actually a very good thing. It only bothers trolls and people using fake accounts.

Keops: It's a good thing if used for the right purposes but I still see plenty of racism and other offensive content on here.

Buttle : surely you don't mean that, do you ? What the fuck does racism have to do with Pouet's admins keeping an eye on visitors'IP ?

Wrong. I'm having a hoot of a time and the idiots in the thread spend their time not procreating. There's a world out there full of people winning.

Wise words. I think shifter is right and we should all get back to more important matters. No hard feelings.

Another pointless comparison (sorry kb, but that suggestion was utterly ridiculous). How do you compare pioneering artists? I mean, if Buttler would be so foolhardy to actually try resembling Stockhausen, how would you judge it? Stockhausen did most of his works ages ago, when it was hard to use an oscillator (if they were around at all?), so it's quite "empty" to judge Buttler on whatever Stockhausen-replica he'd come up with.

I was thinking just like Buttler: "Hell, I could do this in 5 minutes", but then I thought: I probably wouldn't bother doing it using the tools he had at hand. I'd like to believe that he switched to modern tools once they were available and then we're back where this discussion should be heading: The composition.

And then we're discussing taste, which we all know is pointless debating.