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do you think the sound in demoparties is too loud?

category: parties [glöplog]
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added on the 2010-11-27 05:19:47 by xernobyl xernobyl
as some people have been upping the sound at outline, i'd like to underline that outline is a relatively quiet party. no 8-hour dnb mixes until 7 o'clock in the morning, and not a ridiculously full compoprogramme either. i see how for larger parties this is more difficult, simply because the schedule is fuller.

i don't think it's a huge problem having loud sound during the compos. the problem is having loud sound for 16 hours straight, each day. so think about this when you're putting up that next deejay mix or demoshow at a non-breakpoint sized party - the three drunk people who're still up watching it will survive some lower volume.
added on the 2010-11-27 07:47:51 by skrebbel skrebbel
skrebbel: at outline, everybody is outside enjoying the sun anyway :)

I find that it's not much of a problem these days, really .. In the old days, guys would be bringing guitar amps to blare out tinny techno mods over the hall. These days it's really rather limited what people bring. The whole discussion seems to be based on a couple of guys from France who want to be in a sound proof room.
added on the 2010-11-27 11:08:10 by farfar farfar
The point of the discussion is to find out if this is an issue only for "a couple of guys from France" or not, actually.
added on the 2010-11-27 12:01:38 by wullon wullon
wullon: I would say that the discussion so far has proven that it is indeed not a problem for most people.
added on the 2010-11-27 12:55:07 by gloom gloom
Quote:
you've never been to Kindergarden?

come on, you've been sleeping in the strictly-keep-out area with your head in the high voltage fuse box, surely it couldnt have been THAT loud if you managed :)
added on the 2010-11-27 13:54:28 by Gargaj Gargaj
No.
added on the 2010-11-27 13:58:45 by las las
Sounds to me a couple of people missed the point. Everyone seem to agree that sound should be loud, at least for compos. Now that's not the question: the question is whether it's too loud.

Like some said, three days in a row is different from going to a concert. Ears need some breaks at moments to "cool down". It saddens me to hear that a friend is not willing to go to parties anymore for that single reason, while monitoring the level or lowering it by a couple of dB, and making sure there are pauses could do the trick.

Some people argued that one should bring (and use) earplugs. That's obvious, but did they pay attention to the fact he said he did and had some damage even though?

gloom: what is "most people"? Because I think a couple agreed. At what percentage do we consider people who are annoyed (or worse) have a point? Would lowering the level be as much of a pain to people who like it this way, than this way is a pain to people who physically can't bear it?

This is not about killing what makes a demoparty a party, this is about making sure it's a safe one. I hope no one felt otherwise.
added on the 2010-11-27 17:42:48 by Zavie Zavie
wullon: the result is? For sure it's a bit loud at BP but I never had to complain about ear troubles there or after the party.
It's too quiet at french demoparties, maybe it's something with our ears I dunno. Seriously, let's beat out the crap of our old bodies.
if you're dealing out earplugs to enjoy the party you are just doing it wrong.
added on the 2010-11-27 18:46:41 by thec thec
What las said.

Imho the best parties have a loud main PA system and various other sounds/musics playing in the hall - imho bp got it just right. Earplugs are for sleeping-at-the-partyplace, hotels are for those who like to get some real healthy rest.

Personally I slept at the party places of breakpoint in 2009 and 2010, being woken at 10.30ish by the breakpoint jingle was an awesome way to start the day :D
added on the 2010-11-27 19:14:22 by alk alk
I'd say the result is (keeping in mind pouet!=scene):
- some people find the sound at demoparties really annoying, even painful - especially because its is 3 days in a row
- at the main demoscene party, some groups are finishing their prods at the hotel / it's very difficult to have a constructive chat in front of a computer inside the hall (with your group or other sceners). That just feels wrong to me.
- loud sound during the compos + the sound mixture in the party hall are cool since it's part of the demoparty experience (and i agree)

Should party orgas consider the issue? I don't know. Is there actually a solution? I don't know either (big parties = heavy schedule + a lot people). But maybe there is room for improvment (some suggestions are in the thread).
added on the 2010-11-27 19:17:52 by wullon wullon
"For sure it's a bit loud at BP but I never had to complain about ear troubles there or after the party."
to be honest, there were times at BP when it was extremely quiet. way too quiet for my taste of a demoparty. and i wouldnt mind if some more people would bring their guitar amps again and play stupid mods all night. because thats what demoparty is about, you sissies :)
added on the 2010-11-27 19:21:24 by groepaz groepaz
Quote:
Would lowering the level be as much of a pain to people who like it this way, than this way is a pain to people who physically can't bear it?

It was exactly my point. But people tend to take their own experience of loudness as a proof that there is no problem. "I didn't have any problem, si there isn't". It's a polite way to say "fuck you, I'm valid".
added on the 2010-11-27 20:01:53 by ponce ponce
Been a while since this old scener been to a party, but in the 90'ies the parties were only too loud because of the morons that had to bring thier own speakers.

Because of that the main stage sound had to be loud enough to push thou that sound barrier.

Going to a party?
Leave your speakers at home and bring some headphones.
added on the 2010-11-27 20:05:16 by neptun neptun
Quote:
You can't get ear damage below 85 dB.


Where do you get this from?
It's all about the exposure. Duration of time vs sound pressure level.

Every PA technician should own a dB meter.
I'm talking to you, lug00ber.

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.3085

(Sold out at the moment, but this one is pretty accurate. We tested it at work up against a model around five hundred times more expensive.)
added on the 2010-11-27 22:29:25 by irvin irvin
OEREND HARD!
The demo party soundscape is one of my favourite sounds with the following provisio's.

1. You can hear the person you're having a conversation with, at least some of the time.

2. You can find a refuge away from it if needed, a decent sleeping area helps.

3. Self-appointed amateur deejays should remember that, for the most part, they suck ;-)
added on the 2010-11-27 23:18:10 by CiH CiH
#ponce: did anyone ever actually go up to an organizer and complain about this?
added on the 2010-11-27 23:18:20 by Gargaj Gargaj
Quote:
Going to a party?
Leave your speakers at home and bring some headphones.

i loved the brüllwürfel thingie at bp and i also didnt find it too loud (in the sense of ear-damaging loud). i dunno how "official" that setup was, but i would be surprised if the orgas werent informed up front to give their permission.

i can understand that focussing on finishing a prod isnt exactly easy under the given circumstances but its still a party in the first place so music is essential. having a seperate area with a strict speaker-ban could be the solution for that, but i guess many smaller parties cant offer that luxury.
that goes for the "meh i cant conectrate with the music playing, can 100 people please shut up so i can code??" types, tho. if the volume is so high you start to care about your health theres something going wrong for sure(or you shouldnt sit/stand right in front of the main speakers ;). personally i find wearing earplugs uncomfortable, too.

having that said the only party ive been to has been bp10 so maybe it is/was more annoying at other parties, especially the small single-room ones.
what annoys me more than pure volume is a lot of speakers playing all sort of stuff adding up to just being beat-noise from all directions.
Quote:
#ponce: did anyone ever actually go up to an organizer and complain about this?

im quite sure there have been complains about the volume level, at least at breakpoint. remember this =)? the best way to handle it is in my opinion for the orgas/hobby DJs to be sensible enough to react when a noticable number of people complain about the sound being too loud and turn it down a bit.
added on the 2010-11-28 03:55:46 by wysiwtf wysiwtf
Quote:
come on, you've been sleeping in the strictly-keep-out area with your head in the high voltage fuse box, surely it couldnt have been THAT loud if you managed :)

and after that, i moved my sleepingbag right in front of the PA and fell asleep during a dubstep session, iirc (or was that the next night? can't remember). so the sleeping was not a problem indeed, but the other thing i remember from KG is that i spent virtually all time outside or in the little kitchen room because it was impossible to have a meaningful conversation in the main hall due to sound levels. (btw, that's not a complaint, just an observation.)
added on the 2010-11-28 11:00:56 by havoc havoc
I suffer a lot because of the big loudness in nowadays demoparties. Even in demoscene only parties.

I use earplugs (and often earplugs and earmuffs at the same time). It only mitigates a little the pain and the stress.

I would be very grateful if they put down the volume at demoparties (but not in the compos and schedule acts).

The worst thing to me is that I can't be as productive in parties as I would be without the constant loudness. The second worst thing is that I am a little bit upset (even if I try to avoid it) because of the constant loud sound.

To enjoy a demoparty I need moments of silence (or not too much loud at least).

Anyway, this kind of problems are even worse in parties that are not only for demosceners (like Euskal Party in Spain).
added on the 2010-11-28 12:32:37 by ham ham
Gargaj: I should have, but despite this thread I'm not that eager to complain :) especially when people make such a great party. Also it's when you quit the party place that you discover your new hearing, it's a bit of a wild guess before to ask to lower the sound.

I'm not blaming the orga btw, it's not about BP, Ham makes an accurate description of how I felt at every party I've been to (even those considered silent).
added on the 2010-11-28 13:41:37 by ponce ponce
Taken from a party report of the party 1995 :)

"My feet hurt. My eyelids are heavy. The walls under my eyes have reached the bottom part of my chin... I WANNA SLEEP!
But I can't because some nerd (read: organiser) has placed a RAVE party in the sleeping hall :-(... Picture that: you want to sleep and the hall is constantly filled with at least 150 decibells. I spoke with the organisation today for about 1.5 hours and they couldn't give another
explaination then that the rave party was supposed to be in another hall. I don't care... My feet hurt! Dope/Spaceballs"
added on the 2010-11-28 13:50:58 by magic magic
Taken from wikipedia 2010 :)

"The wheelbarrow was first invented in ancient Greece.[1] Two building material inventories for 408/407 and 407/406 B.C. from the temple of Eleusis list, among other machines and tools, "1 body for a one-wheeler (hyperteria monokyklou)"[2] (ὑπερτηρία μονοκύκλου in Greek)"

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