pouët.net

Hasta la Vista El crapOS

nice seminars again this year btw.

Parapete,

a) so far the complaints we received about not supporting Vista in our compos are zero.

b) It's a well known fact that many (especially tech savvy) people steer clear of Vista because not only it doesn't bring any significant advantages to the table (D3D10 being the only exception, still: see a)), also lots of software simply won't run, and demos and especially intros are very likely candidates.

c) I can only agree with Preacher, the only Vista installations in my whole circle of friends/colleagues/etc are either because they're trying it out for fun (and so far everyone returned to XP shortly thereafter) or they are forced to use it because they've got a brand new laptop that doesn't have any XP drivers. Or to put it this way: I know exactly _zero_ people using Vista voluntarily. Everyone who went away from XP either installed Ubuntu or bought a Mac.

Now if that's not "obscure" at least in a demoscene sense, what is?

several reasons against it (at least for this year):

• d3d10-class hardware isn't particularly common among sceners yet. vista is extremely unpopular, and not just among sceners. we felt extremely uncomfortable about accepting demos that require both. (and potentially ending up with several demos that virtually nobody can watch, at least for the time being).
  
• vista has rampant compatibility problems. as it is, unless you've done thorough testing, there's a significant chance your entry doesn't run. since a lot of people don't have access to a vista machine (whether by choice or due to other reasons is irrelevant), this is unacceptable. also, vista still seems to have a significant performance hit, especially with everything non-d3d10. given the host of other problems, this is equally unacceptable.
  
• so we'd end up having to dual-boot. because of the other problems mentioned above, the only entries we'd be willing to boot vista for would be d3d10 entries, of which there would be maybe 1 or 2. we don't accept linux or macos x entries because 1 or 2 entries aren't worth the hassle of installing an extra OS on the (often pre-release engineering sample, so getting drivers is hard) compo machines we get sponsored. vista is out for the same reason.
  

as for the last part, we will most likely change the rules next year, and allow linux and os x (and also vista). might even be that the vista compatibility/performance situation has significantly improved by then (well, i doubt it) - at least the installed base of vista (and dx10 level hardware) definitely will increase. we will have to make sure we get the compo machines early enough to make this work, and if possible pick the components to ensure that linux runs properly. (for osx, we're not exactly sure what to do yet).

if you want to submit a d3d10 demo this year, feel free to do so in the real wild compo.

burglovr: No matter how you call it, Vista being used by sceners is extremely rare, Microsoft doesn't wish XP to support D3D10, so the fact that D3D10-capable hardware itself is becoming common doesn't change a thing.

As sad as it is, D3D10 = Vista = Uncommon platform/less than 10% of the sceners will be able to watch the production = Real wild competition.

That's fair, that's what the real wild competition is for, after all. Releases on platforms that are uncommon for sceners to release on. And as we all know, the releases in Breakpoint's real wild compo are of extremely high quality, so it's a worthy challenge to compete in it with a D3D10 demo.

damn, i obviously took too long to write my reply :)

Three organizers explaining it, that's what I call service (or bad synching ;)

at least it's pretty obvious from our posts that we actually discussed this and came to the same conclusions - we didn't just copy&paste the rules from last year. (just in case - accusations like this are never far when people aren't satisfied with the rules :)

haha Good response time! Apologies if my post seemed needlessly aggressive...

It just seems to me that if you're going to stump for Windows only in the demo compo, you may aswell allow for the newest incarnation. OTOH, if you've recieved zero complaints about not supporting Vista then my comment is completely useless anyway :) You won't be seeing a Vista demo from me ever since I've moved to Ubuntu, but it seems to be a real trend in the scene to stick to Windows/Direct3D.

As for Vista being obscure, well, maybe I don't hang around with enough sceners... All the gamers I know have it installed (and have done for a while), and it's on every single new laptop I see.

I shouldn't have a voice in this because I wont be there but for what little its worth, I think its the right choice after reading your explanations.

Is David Bowie going to play at Breakpoint? Him or Merzbow would be great.

merzbow merzbow merzbow !!! *fingers crossed*

now that obscurity is determining the hardware configuration, i assume SLI should be a no-no then (it is very obscure) and given the fact most sceners dont even own a 8800 either, let's downgrade that to smth like 7600? :D i wish the polymongers good luck :)

using something that is simply a faster than what most people have is a different matter. especially when your projector has a native resolution that's significantly higher than what most people use :)

oh, the band will be romeo knight vs xerxes, or so i read on zine. should be cool. will there be a second band or just that one act?

would be cool to have some 8bit liveact insanity, even if lots of farts would be blablabla real chiptunes and back in my days blabla talking shit about it, would rock to crank your body to the 8bit :)

ps: A second band is planned and going to be announced soon :)

ps: if you want, i can bring my guitar, it'll do nice BZZZZT-noise without touching anything! will you sing?

maali: i can take my mac and scream my lungs out to create highly distorted chopped up vocals floating on acid and a sea of noisy drone feedback. will that do?

excellent! where do we sign up? :D

just added you two to the schedule of our Fourth Stage :)

i always wanted to perform on the fourth stage ever since i was 12 ^o^

isnt that near the bonfire?

We learned recently that the A.D.A.N. non profit organisation that is powering DTV cannot finance the Breakpoint coverage this year.

Next step for DTV will be in july in Vienna (Austria) with [d]vision for a demoscene exhibition.

All the DTV team is very sorry about cancelling this event’s coverage :(

That's sad news. I can't imagine how my Easter would be without it. Fortunately I'm going to be there in person this year ;)