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Concrete / Ephidrena won't run on real amiga...?!

category: general [glöplog]
When I try to run Concrete on my A4000/40, it runs too slow. No surprise, so I run it on my '060/60 -- and it's still too slow! It runs, but some parts are just slow enough (like the flash after the first "rape and ravage" before we go to the tunnel) that it screws up the pacing of the demo down the line (it "stays" flashing for 4 beats of the music, THEN we go to the tunnel.) The low framerate I can handle, but the bad sync I can't...

I know this can't be right, since it runs (WAAAAY too fast) in WinUAE and the pacing is correct. So what is going on? My '060/60 should certainly be fast enough, yes? I've run a few benchmarks and it shows my machine is nearly 3 times as fast as A1200 + T1230/28/42.

What's going on? Is the demo running from slow/chipram? If so, how do I fix it? Is it because I don't have a video card (just using the Amiga 4000's build-in RGB output)? I have a video card I can put in, but it screwed up a few so I removed it.

added on the 2005-05-01 23:28:12 by trixter trixter
It kind of stays on an effect for an extra pattern?
added on the 2005-05-02 00:51:04 by loaderror loaderror
I can't think of a better person to consult with on this particular issue ;-)

Yes, there are a few places where it either stays on an effect for an extra pattern, or an effect is "messed up" (like wrong palette for a pattern during the bridge/clouds texture scene). Is my Amiga too slow? Don't see how that's possible with an '060/60 but maybe slow chipram is to blame...? I'm not sure, I was never an Amiga expert user, just intermediate.

I've tried running it on a stock A4000/40 and it runs worse so I've abandoned that idea. (Speaking of which, what platform did you develop on?)

I can provide a capture of what I'm seeing, if it will help troubleshoot what's going on...
added on the 2005-05-02 07:32:54 by trixter trixter

hmm -- it ran fine on my A4000/040/25! -- EPH lovely

added on the 2005-05-02 08:14:40 by raver raver
I thought it was Concrete / Contraz? (he he he he ... ;(((( )
added on the 2005-05-02 15:45:46 by Gargaj Gargaj
raver: does your A4000/040/25 have an additional video card, or were you just using the built-in RGB output?

Or does that not matter? Can someone educate me here? :-)
added on the 2005-05-02 17:00:06 by trixter trixter
trixter: as this is a "standard aga-demo" a video card doesnt matter at all here.
my guess is that its just Loadys lame code acting up again.
Have you had any similar problems with other demos for "newschool amigas (hehehe)"?
your 060/60 is an a1200, or is that one an a4000 too?
how much fastmem do you have in your machine(s)?
Slummy: I've had a few problems with "newschool" demos but I've usually been able to work around them by capturing on my stock A4000 w/16mb fast. For demos for which a stock A4000 isn't fast enough, I have another A4000 with an '060@60. (In case this wasn't obvious, this is all production work for the next Mindcandy volume.)

On the '060 machine, I have 80MB fast thanks to the ram expansion on my accelerator. It runs OS3.9 because I was told that OS3.9 has native support for accelerators (I don't have any sort of driver disks or anything for the accelerator).

Ideas? If I can't get a decent capture of Concrete, we won't be able to include it on the DVD (which would be a shame since I really like the style).
added on the 2005-05-02 18:40:18 by trixter trixter
I should already know but.. is it a PAL or NTSC machine? Does it matter?
added on the 2005-05-02 19:51:18 by phoenix phoenix
A4000s can be jumpered for NTSC or PAL... both of mine are PAL for obvious reasons :-)
added on the 2005-05-02 20:54:26 by trixter trixter
hmm, I have no idea what can be causing these problems. I'm still guessing it's the good old "Crappy Coder"-bug..
Well, I'm hoping loaderror has an answer or suggestions, because I'm not putting a bad capture onto the DVD ;-)

His question of "effects run for an extra pattern" suggests that he knows what the problem is... as a democoder myself, I certainly know what *kind* of problem that is but I can't confirm/deny without extensive knowlege of the hardware and an Amiga guru I am not.

I wish WinUAE had a more granular speed setting than "too slow to be usable" (68040 native) and "faster than a greased weasel at mach 3" (68040 JIT) because, if it did, I could "fix" the bad sections of my capture with an emulated section or two (had to do this with Love, although that's not a surprise to anyone who knows the demo -- runs 100% *ONLY* on an A1200 w4MB fast, nothing else).
added on the 2005-05-02 21:01:55 by trixter trixter
this comment won't help you at all, but here it is none the less: it worked perfectly on my a1200 w/060 :)
added on the 2005-05-02 21:03:00 by gloom gloom
You're absolutely right, that didn't help at all :-)
added on the 2005-05-02 21:04:19 by trixter trixter
Regarding Love, have you tried the WHDLoad install?

added on the 2005-05-02 21:04:29 by wad_ wad_
so what? it's only an ephidrena demo.
wad: Yes, and that was what I used to capture it on my '040 and it STILL had issues... but that's Love, no surprise. (Yes, we support the software; I have a paid regkey.)

Beau: No scene elitism please. Just looking for tech info that can help... ...or, can you think of a better demo in that style?
added on the 2005-05-02 21:53:08 by trixter trixter
trixter, some (many?) demos won't run on A4000 due to hardware bugs on the motherboard related to interrupt processing, where you have to ACK interrupts two times or some related crap. btw, are you putting up some amiga demos dvd, then?
added on the 2005-05-02 22:23:33 by winden winden
I can't think of a single good demo by ephidrena.
quiet you.
added on the 2005-05-02 23:03:13 by phoenix phoenix
winden: Hardware interrupt issues? Is that why I hear some die-hard amiga fanboyz complain about "AGA out of sync crap" sometimes? Does the A1200 have these issues?

For the record, I have the latest rev board for both my A4000s... or does that not matter?

Amiga DVD: Yes, check www.demodvd.org for ongoing production work on Mindcandy volume 2 -- yes, it has actually begun. Check the developer's blog to see progress.

Beau: Fine, think of a demo that is *like* Conrete but is much better in your opinion.
added on the 2005-05-02 23:28:05 by trixter trixter
I'm trolling, trixter.
Yes. Witness my successful anti-troll method.

(I have kids, you know. They are like 24/7 trolls :-)
added on the 2005-05-03 01:59:08 by trixter trixter
trixter: I was actually impressed by your amazing methods. I must try that sometime.
added on the 2005-05-03 02:07:13 by irvin irvin

mm not going to read all of the above but // i got a4k with no videocard other than AGA +16 megs fast // i assume, you DO run setpatch and start demo within 'clean' CLI?

added on the 2005-05-03 02:35:43 by raver raver


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