pouët.net

ps: one word: NO

All the more that the scene is dead as the dodo.

PS: I share your opinion (for once).

Oh come on, you've always been pretentious and arrogant!

Ps, scene.org should be reserved for scene-related activities. This means both productions and groups. Other comunnities already have their own means of socializing, for example non-demoscene spectrum people have worldofspectrum.org and so on for others... so I think it's fair that you deny the request

no scene reputation - no scene.org space.
just make it simple...

otherwise scene.org will turn into a plattform for demoscene-fanclubs and fr-werkzeug-communities

docd/scoopex^trsi

shifter: he already did

I've always viewed scene.org as a repository of everything released at scene parties, or related to scene parties in some way.
I think scene.org should stay that way, and let other sites take care of these 'independent artists'.
Would certainly be good for the diskspace on scene.org :)

kusma: I was hoping for sequels.

docd: on what do you judge "scene reputation"? On the number of greetings you receive in intros/demos? On the number of top-three releases you deliver at major parties? On the amount of beer you can swallow in 10 minutes?

I think ps and the guys did well so far in selecting worthwhile people, and no, denying free space WON'T ever kill the demoscene: we already had a demoscene when we used "free space" only when talking about camping areas.

Sweet zombie-Jesus -that would validate half of norway!!

Following the ideas exposed in my becanne#4 article... I'd like to see all those new netlabels participating in demoparties and doing things **for** **our?** scene.

I personally trust on ps' space administration; the simple of fact of opening this thread is a sign of his healthy criterion.

We all know what scene is and what is not. Our shared subjectivity shapes objectivity. And IMHO, you're not killing the scene!

Sorry about my lame English : )

I think the point is that the majority of those self-styled holier-that-thou artists cannot be arsed to do so. They simply don't take the concept of the demoscene as valid.

Well, I suppose there must be lots of different people doing music for netlabels, so in my opinion perhaps there are musicians who really like this movement... Generalizing has no sense here.

But who wants what? ftp space? free sex? eternal 8bit glory? :)

im involved in both worlds since i also run enoughrecords netlabel. quite often when talking with other netlabel people a large majority doesnt even know what the demoscene is. most know its about demos. some would be interested in doing music for such projects but dont know who to contact. others try to adapt demoscene concepts into their netlabel to atract more fame (musicdisk interfaces, vjing acts), bottomline is most of them arent interested in visiting parties because they arent familiar with the culture and dont see the profit for their labels reputation. the 8bit artists and labels usually are much more aware of the demoscene, its kinda hard to be hardcore into chip sounds without running into some tracks by a demoscene/crackscene musician.. but labels who do standard electronic music have no tangible connection between the scene. sure they prolly ran a couple cracktros / audiowarez installers but they dont associate it with the demoscene background. They dont feel the need to give back free art to the world in exchange for free tools.

i know they shouldnt, its utopian of me to wish they would. but cant scene.org make a diference by explaining to them what the roots of our scene are? sometimes i feel that just denying them the space instead of educating them on the history is marginalizing them. and by marginalizing the possibly interested people, the active core looses potential.

i guess i'll just add a link to the appform.txt saying not to bother submitting it if you havent read http://demoscene.info

why would you want to make an effort to educate the uninterested? don't get me wrong, i'm all in favour of better publicity and promotion, but there's no need to get religious about it.

because some of them might be interested in contributing if they actually knew what it was about. we no longer live in the age where the great majority of the hardcore computer nerds know about the scene, and that was the main source of new blood in the scene.

no new blood == less fun

yeah.. or we get musickids (for instance that rockmachine guy) asking for demos with music from his netlabel. and the whole 'scene' (== people on pouet) go 'boo, you wanker, go away fat tart' (not exactly in those words, but still, nobody is doing a demo using his tunes right?)

okkie: theoretically if he was truly interested in the scene he would meet and chat with people already active in the scene to try and get his clue around the world. but why should he bother if we mostly seem to prefer to keep to our own niche? in practice he prolly doesnt give a fuck couz no one cared to get him in. the little curiosity he had will just wash away with time.. -_- i tell myself often that if people really care about the scene they'll take the initiative themselfs. but so often i have met and spoken with sceners who have grown innactive and somewhat grown out of the loop, and i notice that if they hadnt started when the hype was big and everyone around them was talking about the new demos and tracked musics they prolly wouldnt even have colaborated to begin with. i can only imagine what nowdays kids with alot less free time and alot less contact with the scene will care. they get excited, they realize its too much work and too closed up of a niche and just settle for sharing their works on some mp3.com clone or deviantart, the newbs pat each other in the back for some leet photoshop manipulations that no competitive designer would even consider using on a product and they move on with their school/univ work till they get a job and gf and couldnt care less about "amateur" realtime digital art anymore.

i would like to think we encourage each other, as sceners, to try harder, try again, practice more to reach some sort of goal (world domination, party winner, greets, recognition by the leets). not just a "well done mate" pat in the back whenever something gets finished.

i think im thinking too much over these useless matters.

my consolation is that i cant be killing something that was already dead on 93, 96, 99 and 2001. ;)

people offering their music for demos are interested in the demoscene i suppose, but as okkie correctly states, apparently noone has the time to make use of their offer. so shouldn't we be making demos with the music that's already available first? trying to get even more musicians to donate tunes we won't have the time to use seems rather pointless, and imho the best way to attract new blood is a steady stream of quality releases...

hehehe.. the scene has died more times than jesus when he did lsd (or crack, or e even)

well, i guess even if we get new kids in, the scene will become smaller and smaller, kids these day have idd different interests, and when 'we' (as in, 'the last active breed') are gone. i doubt there will be much of a scene left.. alas.. all good things end.. don dey.. luckily we can always rejoice in meetings and drink beer, even when we're forty, fifty, sixty or even seventy..

I've said it before, but I'll say it again...
Some things are better off dead than saved.

I don't like the idea of 'converting' artists from other places to demosceners.
I can only speak for myself, but I think it's the same for most people. I just got hooked almost instantly when I accidentally came across the first few demos. I knew that I wanted to do that too.
If demos don't get the same response from people anymore, then either the demos just aren't that good anymore, or the whole demo-thing just doesn't appeal to today's young computergeeks anymore.
Either way, I think the best way to change that situation is to figure out what appeals to today's people, and make demos like that. I suppose Farbrausch is on the right track there :)
Pulling in people from other scenes, without actually concentrating on better (more popular) demos isn't really a long-term solution to keep the scene alive, if you ask me. It will just alienate the scene from what it once was, and what it should be, I think.

Where would you draw the line between 'converting' and getting hooked?

The only reason I got exposed to the PC demo scene was thanks to a (shock) warez trader who simply forced Second Reality on me. Before that time, the only demo-esque impressions I had were solely C64-based, and I was pretty pleased with making lame music using a covox speech thing on a crapped-out 386.

Adding fuel to the bonfire, when are we going to purge netlabels from scene.org whose members act like ignorant assholes? I can't wait for some oldskool eliteism.