pouët.net

Good luck with that. :) And also: no. Just focusing on the size-limited stuff gives people the wrong impression of the demoscene. Too many people already just think that the demoscene is only about 4k intros and such. Just look at the press pieces that have surfaced about the demoscene for the last 5 years - nearly all of them are about 64k or 4k intros, and none of them actually tell you what the scene is about or focus on "normal demos". Why? Because, to them, "normal demos" are just ugly looking games where you cannot move the camera. More or less.

Oh relevance.. you aged, you aged..

Yeah... and I have to do something to pass the time while waiting for a 25 year old piece of plastic to arrive in the mail. :)

On a more serious note, I was discussing the scene with Truck at Asm in the scenebooth where pretty much nobody came. If I was 14 now I probably wouldn't be interested in the demoscene at all. I'd be an obnoxious little 4chan faggot making stupid flash videos. I'd probably make music, as I love doing that, but I'd release it on blogs and would have been as famous as Fukkk Offf and Le Castle Vania.

I would probably know off the demoscene and find it somewhat interesting, but I couldn't be bothered to get into it, since there would be so many other things I'd enjoy doing more.

I'm really happy that I found the scene when I did, since things did change and I think it's for the good they do. Creativity will not stop, but some forms of creativity will eventually cease to exist.

Anyone here macrame much? Or weave a carpet?

so nicely put, okkie :)

ifso, i want a XOR-textured carpet for in the bed room!

might look sexy if it's a bit shaggy and has tints of dark grey and brown

So the Windows PC, with it's GUI, lack of preinstalled programming languages, abundance of games, and the Internet really did kill the scene!?

Who would have thought...

Ahahahaha, yes! Because Amiga didn't have a GUI and games.. oh wai-

it's so much work to do a scroller in 3d :(((

gloom, last page you asked if it's good or bad that demos are described as art more these days. All I can say is I don't think I would have even looked at Second Reality or CD2 if it was described on that coverdisk as "computer art" or "realtime art". It was described as a demo. A demonstration of technical prowess.

To me, "art" suggests something kinda elitist and fancy, something that is exclusive rather than inclusive. It does not compel me to join in. It does not have a party atmosphere, and when I think of computer art I think of stupid interactive exhibits made in VB. Things that are not cool.

That's only my opinion. There are arty demos, and they have helped me appreciate visual art more. Stuff like Chimera or some of SQNY's stuff, which simply project an atmosphere rather than a clear message, but those are not the whole demoscene. The demoscene is mainly competitive and that's what makes it vibrant and interesting and different from art. You don't go to a gallery and vote on the exhibits.

Choose any definition of art, and you can see the link with demos. I personally see demos as a medium to express yourself, a medium that involves visuals and music. On that basis I don't (or increasingly don't) give a rat's ass about technology used and the element of realtime.


The element of competition is irrelevant. And actually you do "vote" on the exhibits in a gallery by buying some instead of others. The artists (and the exhibits) are in a competition for your wallet. That doesn't diminish the value of art.

nice point you have there navis, concerning the "medium".
that's also a way I explain demos to some people (especially to those, coming from a "real" art background): I choose programmed realtime animations to show things, just as others paint something on a canvas using oil colors and again others use pen and paper.

Yeah but the three letter word carries so much baggage and is at the same time so imprecise that I prefer to avoid using it. It hinders communication rather than improving it. I'd rather be talking about specifics of a demo.

This is a nice way of putting it, but fact stays that in the past we made real time demos out of necessity, now, not so much. There is, in principle, no extra merit in doing your 'animations' real time except for maybe a random factor.

i dont think semantics are actually the problem we face when it comes to obtaining new blood though.

at least they don't require million dollar software (that almost everyone pirates)
and sometimes there's new effects that haven't been given an Intensity slider in 3dsmax2012 yet

we might not be abusing our medium's power enough given its potential for randomness/interactivity that nonrealtime doesn't have, but then everyone's probably got their reasons for not going there (ahhhhhh theyre not games theyre demoss! ahhhh random is just an excuse for coder colorss!!!! ahhhhhh)

that's what I also say usually, but then again there is one small thing: in theory (that is, limited by the realtime factor, which just nowadays doesn't strike that soon anymore) I'm not limited by anything except my own skills and inspiration. no programs to fiddle with, no missing functions, no workarounds around missing features: what I need can be implemented in some way.
that's btw also the cause why I hardcode everything instead of writing myself a tool. I would need to invest far too much time in finding and implementing a concept that works for me.
oh, we're getting OT.
=)

Not enough noise.

<-- This looks nice.

Personally, I'd find a program generating that in realtime even nicer though. Can't explain why, that's just what makes demos interesting for me... YMMV. I guess it's just like the classic debate about old hardware "using the real hardware vs. using an emulator".

what exactly did you do in there?

The wrong thing obviously :(

okkie it was pretty nonexistent this year anyways. I mean it was in the middle of nowhere :(. also truck, I have your pen! :)

also,

not good enough unless you raymarch it!