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Re: Which was the first demoscene demo?

category: general [glöplog]
But hey, srsly, to say Black Sabbath "coined" heavy metal is something different vs. saying Black Sabbath "invented" heavy metal. Similar thing here. I'm pretty sure lots of cracker crews venturing towards intros etc went down this road during the same time period, each influencing the other, ultimately we got the "demoscene" (uh, what is the demoscene, btw? what does belong to it and what does not?). anyways, I guess it's possible to identify some important influencers, but looking for "the very first and one and only demoscene demo" is bullshit, sry.
added on the 2018-09-27 00:42:10 by jco jco
the Dutch invented the demoscene, just like they invented the VCR, CD and benefits of smoking weed for being inventive. period. how can this even still be a discussion?
added on the 2018-09-27 00:44:10 by Maali Maali
Maali, please enlighten me which CD exactly it was they invented. They invented the laserdisc too, didn't they? but which one precisely?
added on the 2018-09-27 01:10:12 by jco jco
I invented the demoscene.
added on the 2018-09-27 06:24:23 by Adok Adok
Ok, the demoscene is now officially dead.
added on the 2018-09-27 11:00:29 by xTr1m xTr1m
You know:

I invented the Internet.
- Al Gore
added on the 2018-09-27 16:15:56 by Adok Adok
I can't believe I'm posting any more into this dumpster fire of a "discussion", but I'm drunk and bored so here goes.

Fact: even with (seemingly) strict constraints it is COMPLETELY impossible to define *THE* first "demoscene demo". I'd guess no one would dispute that at this point.

However, it may very well be viable to declare A POINT IN TIME (say, month) during which a majority of "computer freak" stuff was mostly being released conforming to (somehow) accepted "demoscene" constraints X, Y, Z and beyond.

Will this specify the "first demo ever"? Most likely not. Is it at least culturally/historically interesting and a valid point to continue one's research on? Fuck yeah!

The question becomes, how do you define these constraints? I believe many attributes have already been laid out in this discussion, but obviously there is no 100% correct answer. This is the actually interesting part of the work to be donw.

I myself am a "newschool" lamer who only got interested in the scene around 1989/1990, when most of this shit was already well established. Personally, I'd be very interested in hearing the viewpoints of the people who were actually active when this awesome culture of ours was only forming up.

At which point was there a generally approved understanding of common goal(s)? When did the first set of generic features emerge for others to emulate in order to fit in with a "scene"?

So many questions, so much data beyond "lol I saw a Melon Dezign demo as a kid so they must be the first demo group like ev4r!!111"..
added on the 2018-09-28 01:54:55 by break break
added on the 2018-09-28 02:21:24 by break break
Which was the first diskmag?
Presumably CURSOR, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CURSOR
These are also the first demos (which imho already deserve to be called that) I remember watching as a kid.
added on the 2018-09-28 09:43:14 by merkur merkur
merkur: thanks!
added on the 2018-09-28 13:56:28 by wertstahl wertstahl
So you think the first diskmagazine was actually on cassette..? Oh but wait, it gets weirder... Here's the vinyl record (yes :)) that came with "Interface Age" in March of 1977 (a year before CURSOR's first edition):
BB Image
added on the 2018-09-28 14:50:07 by havoc havoc
so that's how Autechre makes his music!
added on the 2018-09-28 15:32:37 by Maali Maali
Oh great, now hipster coders are going to want to release demos on vinyl.
added on the 2018-09-28 15:57:59 by phoenix phoenix
now this gets really interesting. finally.
added on the 2018-09-28 17:33:13 by wertstahl wertstahl
maybe they will tell us in this book https://fr.ulule.com/demomaker-amiga
added on the 2018-10-07 21:07:04 by mop mop
Wat'n scheunet Book! Schaad dat et keene vertalung op plattdüüsch gifft.
added on the 2018-10-08 01:00:51 by wertstahl wertstahl
Whilst risking alot of boos and annoyance, i can't help but ask the following:
Is it possible that the emerge of hip-hop culture (interdiscipilinary activities like making Music, DJing, writing Vocals, Rapping, Nicknames, founding of Crews, trying to impress/battling, acquiring skills and equipment, like-minded-subculture-gatherings and even spreading Mixtapes (Prods/Demos)) bears a striking resemblance to the upcoming Demo/Cracking/Computerist Scene at basically the same time? Rap/Hip-Hop obviously started around 1973ff having it's peak of impact in the early 80s, just like Home Computers had? I was just watching "Beat Street" (1984) and cannot help but thinking that it is basically interlinked, in terms of the Computerist Scene being an "extension" of the Hip-Hop Culture. Any thoughts?
added on the 2018-10-18 01:58:25 by wertstahl wertstahl
I think the similarities you're seeing are rather explained by cultural conditions of the era rather than proof for any actual interlinkage. Speaking for myself, the first time I realized that hiphop existed was via "Holiday Rap" in 1986, that's multiple years after I saw my first cracktro :)
added on the 2018-10-18 08:31:34 by havoc havoc
you could find correlations with all kinds of pop cultural phenomena. maye the rubiks cube vs cubes in demos. also, rubik lube would be a nice theme for a dentro.
added on the 2018-10-18 08:54:27 by jco jco
i think in terms of size and visibility the hiphop subculture was way bigger than the computer scene and started also a bit earlier, so if anything hiphop and its underground structures around crews inspired the computer people and not so much the other way around.
added on the 2018-10-18 11:12:20 by wysiwtf wysiwtf
I think it comes much more from the old computer enthusiast scenes of the '60s/'70s.
added on the 2018-10-18 14:29:14 by 4mat 4mat
the common denominator is young teenagers being bored...
added on the 2018-10-18 15:35:17 by Maali Maali
I have no idea at the moment which demo can be considered as first one - as coded on the computer. But if we try to look deeper into the art as visualisations with the music I have got something very interesting and beautiful what was made by the Auroratone in 1940s. ANd I considered this as very early demos (today probably they would take participation in wild category?) - u can read more how they were done.

This is what I thought. But right now I found something more old and amazing:

The Clavilux, or Color Organ
The Clavilux was a device that displayed a psychedelic light show on a screen. It was invented by Thomas Wilfred in 1919, who hoped that it would become so popular that one day every home would have one. That didn't quite work out. Though one of these sitting in your living room definitely would be a conversation piece. To me it is as amazing. Same as demos coded in programming languages. It was great thing. Have they ever thought that people will enjoy such similar things in the future?
added on the 2018-10-18 19:32:14 by Creonix Creonix
But hey, srsly, to say Black Sabbath "coined" heavy metal is something different vs. saying Black Sabbath "invented" heavy metal. Similar thing here.

copy(ed) that, what jco said there! ;)
It was Sir Kilmister himself who really invented it! But thats different things! ;) "coined" (Sabbath) vs "invented" (Motörhead) !!

On my mind the inventor of PunkRock is Iggy Pop (together with The Stooges!!!), but ask any other Punkrocker and they all have their own Mind! ;)
-> Punkrock is anarchism, The Scene is too! And i am not talking about politics here, just the mindset...copying or not, stealing or not, taking something and making it better?! ;)

Wherever there are no rules, there will be blooming, renewing by itself, life as intended! :)

--> The inital Q -> it doesn´t matter at all! As long as we keep living and improving it by not applying any rules! :p


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