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A demo festival is not a demo festival. It's demo party :)

kb: Spot on.

The demoscene is a more-or-less closed community, and that's why it works and exists. The scene world we are living in to me works much better than the outside world. You do not win compos because you have the most money or promotion, or because you've managed to ride the newest hype wave, but because of your skills. We do not judge based on the amount of money, cars or bitches you have, but based on you are doing for your community. I'd rather try to transport these concepts into the "outside world" than the other way round.

Paniq: If you really think that being famous with people you do not know is important to you, I wish you all the best luck, but please do not except the scene to change to support this. In the process most stuff that makes being part of the scene something special would be killed.

What a terrible, terrible idea.

Kb, scamp: Great how you guys want to see some of the brightest members of your community to succeed in life. ;)

I don't think this is about being famous. Being famous is terrible, actually. It's more about getting your productions around, maximum exposure - I want popularity for my productions, not for myself. I'm not the only one who feels like this. How is that a bad thing?

I'm not retreating my request. I still think it's a good idea.

Those who complains about the demoscene should go and make a demo about it! :D

Of course. It's yours, and you clearly won't take analogies for an argument.


If there's more people who think like that, no doubt you can build something around that sentiment. I'd like to rephrase a something I quipped some time ago: go and make a demoparty about it.

I completely understand the (very good) arguments why my idea doesn't work - and I accept them. Hell, I totally agree.

Yet I'd like to see a different approach. I'm not in the position to do my own party, so let's put this thread to sleep, before anyone gets hurt.

In fact, this thread is over since 2 pages already.

I want to see fr-043 on a big screen again. That was one of the best things I've seen in a long time. But that does not mean that I want to see it in the democompo at Evoke or tUM again! That so doesn't make sense, people have already summed that up nicely. Instead, I want way more "demonights" at parties or whatever (sadly, the scene.org demonight didn't take place on saturday AFAIK), maybe even with the possibility for people to requests certain demos.

I see nothing wrong with reshowing older demos on the bigscreen outside of a competition. I think this is done most places anyway. Seems like a waste of a bigscreen to just show giant ads for the wifi network all day.

I don't think they should be allowed to enter competitions at multiple parties though.

That's perhaps the saddest bit.

Yet you've completely failed to explain how any of this is related to your request. First, why would you need to participate in a compo? If you just want exposure, there's demoshows at most parties. Most well-liked demos of the past 2 years are likely to be on the bigscreen at some point on any demoparty. Second, how would this even help? Releasing demos at multiple parties is preaching to the choir. Making the same 1000 people watch your demo in the compo at 3 parties instead of 2 isn't going to get you any more exposure, it's just gonna annoy people. If you want more exposure, promote your demos to people outside the demoscene that don't know your releases forwards, backwards and sideways already. The demoscene is way too self-centered as it is.

Besides, leaving the other differences to film festivals that others have pointed out already aside, there's one central aspect that I haven't seen mentioned so far: the clientele of film festivals are people who like to watch movies, while the clientele of demoparties is people who are involved in making demos. The whole idea behind the "original releases" rule is that you're showing your demo to other demo creators, and it's assumed that they're not just actively making demos, but watching them as well. Treating demo creators as if they didn't know the demos already and needed to be "educated" is something I find highly disrespectful and patronizing.

Then there's also the fact that at film festivals you know in advance what's running and just don't show up at a showing if you're not interested. And the fact that the equipment to view actual film is expensive and hard to find, while the equipment to view demos is relatively cheap and most people have it already (if they can't run the demos, they can at least watch videos). And that copies of rare movies are really hard to get and quite expensive to make/rent, while "copies" of "rare" demos are instantly available for no charge at scene.org. The list goes on and on and on.

I completely agree with ryg.

Demoparties are made by creative people and for creative people. We want to talk about new stuff and see the new creations.

"Demofestivals" would be another kind of event. Maybe a big demofestival inside a big lanparty, for example, would be good for promote the scene among outsiders.

But demoparties must continue being demoparties.

1. Make demo (read: short film).
2. Convert demoscene into free advertising platform.
3. ???
4. Profit!

Part "3. ???" is optional. I mean, for a real demoscener (real, not imaginary), make a demo always leads to instant profit! :D

you're in the wrong scene then... if you wanna get famous, make a youtube video of yourself fart-fluting the popular demo theme whilst quoting a passage from Faust backwards, doing a level 4 sudoku and balancing a fishbowl on your head! dancing the macarena is optional!

A demo festival is an interesting idea! Something like a cross between a film festival and a demo party, competitions wouldn't be the core of the event so much and there would be more 'non-scene' stuff going on. We could have a more interesting kind of demoshow, where the creators themselves introduce their demo, talk about it a little and then show it on the screen (something like that would keep leonard quiet too ;)

Leonard: Why you don't just go show your prods in one of the thousand film/shortfilms/numericart/vj/whatevernotademo festival already existing ? If it is what you want.

@lenard "paniq" ritter: but but but but ... that would make the scene.org awards unneccesary... wich are so to speak the quick-fix for not beeing able to submit on multiple parties or getting not enough recognition at the party where you released you stuff :P

Something just happened, that doesn't occur very often. But i actually understand Paniqs point. ;)

What exactly is bad about the very idea to make all day long what you love doing the most?

Wouldn't most of you guys like to spend more time on making demos? I guess most of us have daily jobs and have to squeeze a lot of their scene activity in the remaining few hours of the day. At least i have to and it's tiresome. I'd do way more demos if i had more time.

And finding a bigger audience for your beloved work ain't bad either. Is it?

i'd love to have more time making demos, but i'd hate to have official expectations above them, and having a bigger audience has nothing to do with changing compo rules.

and I am confused now.

Gargaj,

that compo rule thing imho ain't the interesting part but the idea behind all that. And talking about expectations, well... Look at any not-so-big Farbrausch demo's comments and go figure...

I really don't like the idea because I like to see original content. Sure, sometimes it's fun to see back older demos, but that's what demoshows are for. Just make a kickass demo, something people will like, and you can be sure that it'll get played on a bigscreen at some party more than once.

well, i have to admit i get paniqs point - and if we where the stand-up commedy scene it would be perfectly reasonable. but i don't think it's applicable here.

and guys: don't bash paniq too much. he had an idea wich seedmed from his point of view perfectionaly reasonable and he steped forwarad and presented it. thats a good thing, we should encourage that instead of bash it. if the idea is non applicable or just simply "not the best idea paniq ever had" or whatever - fine. but no need for bashing :P

also if you see a great demo and someone says "YEAR... winner ... END of COMPO .. AMIGAAAA!!!!" and then the screen changes and you see a name from a cool group and every body is cheering and applauding .. these are among great moments that really define the scene. imagine the bigscreen shows instead the name of a production you already saw... everyone would gou "meeeeeeeeeeh". that would really take away A HUGE FUCKING lot. I totally understand the whole "a change without consequence is no change at all" type of thing paniq is trying to adress here, but i think what we could gain by following paniqs suggestion is much less compared to the beforementioned "OHH AHHH *chheer*"-thing at the compo that we would give up. (wich we should not do)

my a-bit-less-confused-2cents.

Hmm, whats up with the intel demo compo. No more?